Interview of Gene Wheaton Re Actual JFK Assassins Conducted by William Law and Mark Sobel in 2005

Detailed Summary: Gene Wheaton HD Testimony:

- (01:14-01:51) ARRB Contact and Documents Provided: In July 1995, Wheaton furnished Mrs. Buter at the Assassination Records Review Board with sensitive documents, photos, and information about CIA covert connections to Cuba, Florida, Louisiana, Texas, and Mexico during months and years before and after the Dallas assassination. Mrs. Buter expressed interest in following up but suddenly departed from the board without further contact.

- (01:51-02:22) Generic Response Letter: Wheaton received a dismissive response from Joan Sullivan, Press and Public Affairs Officer, dated March 31, 1998. The letter acknowledged receipt of materials about CIA-Cuba-Florida-Louisiana-Texas-Mexico connections but claimed limited resources prevented tracking which records were opened due to specific individuals' contributions, with the board's mandate ending September 30, 1998.

- (02:51-03:42) Wheaton's Background and Iran Assignment: Gene Wheaton identifies as a retired Army special agent who served as narcotics and counter-terrorist advisor to the Shah of Iran in the 1970s. His connection to Carl Jenkins began in 1976 through the IBEX program - a CIA-fronted billion-dollar airborne electronic intelligence program managed by Rockwell Corporation.

- (03:42-04:22) IBEX Program Assassinations: On August 26 or 28, 1976, three IBEX managers were machine-gunned to death in Tehran - program manager Bill Cantrell and two assistants who were in the wrong place at the wrong time. The CIA, State Department, and embassy asked Wheaton to take over as director of security because "they couldn't afford to have anybody else killed."

- (04:22-05:44) IW Harper Connection: Before the assassinations, another retired CIA officer left the IBEX program unexpectedly in July 1976. Johnny "IW" Harper, a "shooter and explosives" assassination specialist who worked in Libya with Edwin Wilson (prosecuted for shipping 40,000 lbs of C-4 explosives to Libya and training Libyan terrorists), replaced him but had to leave within 48 hours when Bob Woodward was preparing an exposé.

- (05:44-07:19) Meeting Carl Jenkins: After the 1979 Iranian Revolution, IW Harper introduced Wheaton to Carl Jenkins, and they became "very close friends." Jenkins was a retired high-level CIA paramilitary specialist who "headed up the largest covert base in Laos during the secret CIA war" while the Vietnam War was ongoing.

- (07:19-08:44) Freelance Security Consultant Work: With a bounty on his head from Iranian revolutionaries, Wheaton worked freelance in Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, and Egypt. He got his name on the State Department's preferred specialist list, receiving telexes for security assignments. He emphasized "nobody was my boss" - he picked his own work and maintained liaison with Middle East desks, embassies, DIA, CIA, and the Pentagon.

- (08:44-10:09) High-Level Political Connections: Wheaton's mentor was Senator Hugh Scott of Pennsylvania, the Senate minority leader under Nixon. Through Scott, he partied with CIA Director Bill Casey and Vice President George H.W. Bush, and was introduced to Egyptian Ambassador Ghorbal, Pakistani Ambassador General Yaqub Khan, and other diplomats for security contracts including Cairo Airport and Jeddah Airport design work.

- (11:40-12:15) Jenkins Family as CIA Officers: Carl Jenkins married his wife while she was his interpreter when he served as "secret police of Somoza down in Nicaragua." He helped her get her master's and PhD, essentially becoming "his own wife's case officer." She became head of a CIA division overseeing all their "psychologist PhD shrinks" while he did contract work since he couldn't be promoted as a retiree.

- (12:15-13:59) Living with Jenkins and Iran-Contra Connection: Wheaton flew between Southern California and Washington DC, eventually using an extra bedroom at Jenkins' Fairfax, Virginia home to store papers and clothes. In 1985, Jenkins became Wheaton's Washington representative when he was vice president of National Air, a cargo airline wanted by Iran-Contra operatives for hauling weapons to the Contras and supporting Afghan Mujahideen against the Soviets.

- (13:59-15:24) Introduction to Iran-Contra Players: Jenkins and other CIA people introduced Wheaton to Rob Owen (Oliver North's point man for the Contras) and arranged breakfast with Adolfo Calero, head of the Contras in Washington. They wanted Wheaton's airplanes and his Middle East/counterterrorism background to support operations in Afghanistan and Central America after the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan in December 1979.

- (15:24-16:12) Jenkins' Bay of Pigs Role: Carl Jenkins was the head recruiter and trainer for Bay of Pigs invasion assassination and sabotage teams that went into Cuba pre-invasion to lay groundwork. He recruited 17-19 year old Cuban exiles in Miami and Guatemala, trained them, and became their "father figure." Ted Shackley headed the Miami station and worked directly for Jenkins.

- (16:12-17:01) Cuban Protégés: Several of Jenkins' recruits were captured at Bay of Pigs and imprisoned. Jenkins led negotiations for their release involving tractors and medical supplies for Castro. Rafael "Chi-Chi" Quintero became "like a son to Carl," along with Felix Rodriguez and Nester Sanchez - all went through Vietnam, Africa, and the Congo with Jenkins during operations against Patrice Lumumba's government.

- (17:01-18:16) Meeting the Cuban Operatives: Chi-Chi Quintero would fly from Miami to stay at Jenkins' house where Wheaton lived. Wheaton and Jenkins would pick him up at National Airport. Chi-Chi discussed his daughter's emotional problems (she was attending Georgetown University) with Wheaton. Before November 21, 1986 (when Iran-Contra broke), Chi-Chi, Oliver North, and General Richard Secord would meet at spook attorney Tom Green's office to discuss strategies.

- (18:16-19:21) Family-Like Atmosphere: Wheaton lived with Jenkins, ate with them, and when the Cubans or other retired CIA officers visited, they'd have weekend barbecues and dinners (especially Oriental food because of their time in Southeast Asia) in McLean and Fairfax, Virginia. "They talk directly to me and to each other in my presence as if I was one of the spook crowd, covert crowd."

- (19:57-21:20) Probing About JFK Assassination: Initially Wheaton "pretended like I was deaf" when they discussed sensitive topics, but later started "feeling Carl out and Chi-Chi Quintero particularly because Chi-Chi was a shooter and he was trained by IW Harper." Jenkins was from Louisiana and was "the CIA liaison with Carlos Marcello the mafia boss" connected to Sam Giancana and John Roselli, all linked in public record to the Kennedy assassination.

- (21:20-22:44) The Assassination Plot Revealed: Working with Senator Hugh Scott to get immunity in exchange for setting the record straight, Wheaton learned the "straight story": There was a CIA-funded program to assassinate Castro that Jenkins ran, training Miami Cubans who would drive old convertibles to Mexico hills and practice on watermelons in the back seat using "triangulation shooting teams." They diverted the Castro assassination funds and training "for their own agenda to snuff Kennedy."

- (22:44-24:04) Dual Motivations for Killing JFK: The Cubans were "livid furious" about imprisonment at Bay of Pigs and JFK's last-moment backing off from supporting the invasion. Above them was "another click at the political elite level within the shakers and movers of the country and with the very top people in the CIA and the Pentagon and the White House" who didn't want Kennedy to shut down the Vietnam War because "they wanted it to escalate" in the early 1960s.

- (24:04-26:21) Lee Harvey Oswald as Patsy: Jenkins, as a Marine Corps captain in the early 1950s after Korea, "formed the first Marine Corps Reserve unit in New Orleans, Louisiana" and was CIA liaison to Carlos Marcello and organized crime. Through his Marine Reserve connection and CIA involvement, he "helped recruit Lee Harvey Oswald into the CIA while Lee was a marine." Oswald was "just a patsy that they set up" with "an operational security plan for deniability when something when they put a real dirty covert operation into place."

- (27:28-29:17) Immunity Offer and Rejection: Wheaton, working with Senator Hugh Scott, proposed getting the conspirators "total immunity if you'll just tell the whole straight story," appealing to Chi-Chi's desire for a normal life with his wife and kids. About 6 weeks later, when Chi-Chi flew up from Miami for another meeting with Tom Green and Oliver North, Jenkins told Wheaton: "We've been given it serious thought but we've decided that we're just going to let things stand as they are and if you ever try to change the record we'll just totally discredit you and deny everything."

- (30:01-30:34) Jenkins' Later Life: When Wheaton testified in federal court in Washington DC in March 1987 about Iran-Contra and Jenkins' name came up, the CIA transferred Elizabeth Jenkins to Japan "to get her out of the limelight and away from me." Carl went with her as her dependent. They later divorced; she stayed with the agency while Carl "married some Panamanian woman and went down to Panama and was facilitating weapons and money movement" before reportedly returning to the Washington-Baltimore area in old age.

- (31:59-33:44) Exposing Iran-Contra: Jenkins fed Wheaton information about Oliver North and Richard Secord before Iran-Contra broke. Wheaton briefed CIA Director Bill Casey in spring 1986; Casey claimed "CIA is not involved in this thing." Wheaton then briefed Marine Commandant General Kelly, saying to "get Ollie North out." His motivation: "They were stealing billions of dollars worth of weapons paid for by your tax dollar and selling them to terrorist states...to both Iran and Iraq and pocketing the money in Swiss bank accounts and Turks and Caicos Islands."

- (34:14-36:07) Potential Corroborating Witnesses: Wheaton identifies Chi-Chi Quintero (now about 60, originally 17-18 at Bay of Pigs) and Nester Peña (retired Army full colonel, possibly teaching at Army War College or School of the Americas) as potential witnesses, though "none of these guys will talk - they were talking within their own click, they won't talk to outsiders." Peña was commissioned as Army 2nd Lieutenant after Cuban prison, transferred to Marine Guard as captain, and was part of setting up El Salvador death squads with Nester Sanchez.

- (36:47) Additional Documentation Source: Wheaton directs investigators to Matt Ehling, an independent documentary producer in Minneapolis/St. Paul who produces for PBS and National Public Radio. Ehling has interviewed Wheaton "a dozen times" over 7-8 years with "hours and hours and hours" of raw video footage and tape recordings covering most of these topics in detail.
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Original Source Attribution:

'Gene Wheaton HD' | Debra Conway - JFKLancer | Jun 15, 2017 | https://youtu.be/0DPT9Oc0lsU?si=mnMPFw7WpcTaA0Ki

Evaluating Gene Wheaton as a source:

Wheaton attempted to take his information to the government via a Congressperson as soon as he was aware of it. Wheaton did not add any further details over the time frame of his efforts to register his information first with a Congressman and ultimately to the ARRB.

Wheaton provided information consisting of comments made by two men with knowledge in regards to the shooting of JFK. While the men purportedly named other individuals, or at least described them in some detail, the two men themselves were not involved. Wheaton named the two men and identified them as secondary sources in regard to a conspiracy. One of the men had trained certain of the individuals during his work with the CIA as a military trainer and the second was a Cuban exile who had been in that training and personally knew some of the individuals involved in the assassination. Wheaton also provided corroborative documents demonstrating his personal association with both men during the time frame of the purported remarks they had made related to the events in Dallas.

• The timing of his contact with the two men is independently corroborated.
• Wheaton’s association with both men is corroborated.
• The two men’s backgrounds are corroborated as Wheaton described them.
• Wheaton took none of his information public and never expected his
confidential contact with the ARRB to become public.

Wheaton described the threats made to him if he did attempt to report his information even if only privately, primarily consisting of efforts to discredit him as a viable source. Efforts to discredit Wheaton can be corroborated.

Wheaton later expended his own resources in an effort to bring his information to the ARRB, making multiple contacts and providing extensive documentation. The ARRB failed to pursue or even corroborate Wheaton’s information

The ARRB staff member handling Wheaton’s information resigned from the ARRB staff. When contacted several years later the staff member claimed not to have any memory at all of Wheaton, his documents or repeated contacts with him.

Independent - albeit anecdotal - information connected individuals associated with one of the men named by Wheaton as having knowledge of a conspiracy related to the murder of JFK that information includes a call made by RFK the afternoon of the assassination.

From Larry Hancock: the 2010 version of "Someone Would Have Talked" author Larry Hancock goes into the vetting in some detail. He is absolutely who he said he was and did what he claimed...that was confirmed by the documents he turned over to the ARRB. As to non-disclosure, not really relevant because the contacts he described occurred with him as a private citizen engaged in routine business practices, in this instance air transportation contracting. What he discloses in his background remarks relates strictly to employment and that is backed up by the documents.
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