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Journalist Michael Tracey discusses problems with what he call the "Epstein mythology"

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What is the Jeffrey Epstein story, and what does it mean? Just asking questions.

Today's conversation is with journalist Michael Tracey, who has been picking apart what he calls the "Epstein mythology" for the past several weeks over at his Substack. In short, he thinks 90 percent of what most people believe about this case is false, and that this is mostly the fault of credulous establishment journalists who chose to uncritically publish alleged victims' narratives and ignore inconvenient facts, as well as opportunistic alternative media figures who spun the story into a sprawling conspiracy for political and personal gain.

Tracey has been attacked and on the attack, and you'll hear him air his many grievances with other journalists, lawyers, and politicians in this conversation, including Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene (R–Ga.), whom he calls out as his "enemy" because she instructed police to remove him from an Epstein-related press conference after he asked a question about an accusers' credibility in Washington D.C. this week.

The goal of this episode was to move beyond the personality clashes and egos and wild speculation and drill down into what it is we actually know and don't know about Jeffrey Epstein. But as we talked, it became clear that this kind of detached analysis just wasn't going to be possible, that the egos and the clashes and the agendas remain intricately tied up with how this story has unfolded. The incentives faced by establishment journalists, podcasters, accusers, and politicians have shaped this story and our understanding of it, mostly for the worse.

But in the marketplace of ideas, there is also a countervailing incentive to move against the herd and correct the record. And maybe a turbulent and confrontational personality like Michael Tracey–who admits in this interview that he's "wired differently"–was exactly what was needed to break taboos, ask uncomfortable questions, and push for real disclosure about the nature of the story that has loomed over American politics for at least a decade.

Regardless of how one feels about Tracey's tone or the soundness of his analysis, anyone who purports to care about this story should at least engage with the questions he's asking and start asking their own questions about what the Epstein story really means.

This conversation has been edited for time and clarity.

00:00 Zach's introduction
03:44 Beginning the Conversation: Michael Tracey's Motivation and Initial Perspective
00:15:00 Epstein's Documented Guilty Pleas and Legal Record
00:27:00 The "Kernel of Truth": Epstein's Reckless Early 2000s Behavior
00:40:00 Ghislaine Maxwell's Contested Conviction
00:55:00 Financial Incentives for Accusers and Victim Compensation
01:10:00 Epstein's Alleged Intelligence Connections
01:25:00 The 2008 Plea Deal
01:40:00 High-Profile Accusations: Prince Andrew and Others
01:55:00 The "Blackmail Scheme" Theory
02:08:00 Journalistic Malfeasance and Fictionalized Accounts
02:20:00 Political Interference and Flawed Transparency Initiatives
02:35:00 Tracey's Press Conference Confrontation
02:45:00 Tracey's take on what he calls the "Epstein Mythology"
02:50:00 The Broader Impact of Alternative Media