Rand Paul Throws Down with Fox Host over J.D. Vance Criticism: ‘That’s Not Constitutional!’

CAIN: “— get with you to today is over President Trump and the Secretary of War Pete Hegseth’s fight on the narco terrorists. We saw a little over a week ago the bombing of a drug-running vessel in the Caribbean. To that, Vice President J.D. Vance, he said the following. He said: ‘Killing cartel members who poison our fellow citizens is the highest and best use of our military.’ You responded very, very forcefully. J.D. ‘I don’t give a s***’ Vance says killing people he accuses of a crime is the highest and best use of the military. Did he ever read To Kill a Mockingbird? Did he ever wonder what might happen if the accused were immediately executed without a trial or representation? What a despicable and thoughtless sentiment it is to glorify killing someone without trial.’ Now, Senator, I’d love to set aside your To Kill a Mockingbird analogy for a moment. I don’t think, truthfully, that it is applicable. That is an American citizen on American soil dealing with American laws. I think a better analogy might be Thomas Jefferson and the Barbary pirates, which he launched that war without a congressional authorization. I see your smile. I know you’re ready for your response. But he did launch those attacks without congressional authorization on what he saw as a threat to American interest and to Americans. Distinguish that from what the president is doing with the drug cartels.”

Paul: “Well, there’s one big difference. The Barbary pirates were attacking us and taking our sailors and capturing our ships. They were committing acts of war against us and fighting them is self-defense. And if this speedboat 2,700 miles from our coast was attacking one of our destroyers, they can blow it up.”

CAIN: “Well, hold on —“

Paul: “Nobody argues with that.”

CAIN: “Real quick, Senator. The narco terrorists are attacking in a different fashion. It’s not as on the nose as what the Barbary pirates did.”

Paul: “I know.”

CAIN: “They’re importing drugs that do kill Americans to the tune of 65,000 Americans a year.”

Paul: “Yeah, I realize — I realize that. But if this is a new policy, realize that off of Miami, a dozen ships will be interdicted today. They will be stopped, boarded and searched. Some of them will have drugs, some of them won’t. The reason we board them before we blow the crap out of them is some of them don’t have drugs. Think about it this way. This is how people don’t quite get this. Let’s say there’s a house in your neighborhood and they’re all selling fentanyl and thousands of people have died and you’re just so mad. Do you go over there and just kill them or burn them? No, you go to a judge and you get a warrant and you do that.”

CAIN: “But, Senator —“

Paul: “We have an interdiction program.”

CAIN: “I feel like the difference there is you’re talking about an American citizen on an American soil. And of course —“

Paul: “No, we’re talking ships off of Miami. We’re talking about people speeding along off of Miami. Are we going to just simply blow them up? No, we’re not.”

CAIN: “Let me — let me — let me give you a scenario back.”

Paul: “I mean, if we were, that would be extraordinary. That would be extraordinary to blow up ships.”

CAIN: “It’s not simply your neighbor and you’re mad at your neighbor. It is the United States government, the Department of War, and in certain intelligence, which by the way, I don’t accept wholeheartedly or think they are flawless on, but it is a certain level of intelligence where we hear this is what’s happening and this is who we struck. We would rely on those very same institutions if we were told, for example, a foreign power or a terrorist were bringing in on a ship VX gas or sarin gas, which equally would kill Americans. This just happens to be fentanyl. Would you oppose the military striking a ship headed towards our shores with VX gas?”

Paul: “No, and the question is this, though: we have dozens of ships every day stopped for drugs. Is the new policy going to be blow them to smithereens with drones? I can’t imagine that’s going to be our policy, it would lead to chaos. We have dozens of ships. Think of it also this way. I’m not saying this is U.S. citizens, but when we try to protect U.S. citizens’ rights, we still make mistakes. We get a judge’s warrant, we send the police to a house, sometimes the numbers get transposed and they go in the wrong house and the wrong people die, even with the utmost care. What are the chances that somebody on a boat leaving Venezuela actually has been — their parents have been kidnapped and the boat has been taken, you’re told to drive us to this island or we’ll kill your parents. And the people on the boat actually aren’t even the people that you’d like to kill, that someone’s been kidnapped to do this? It’s the same way with sex trafficking. Some people on boat may be the ones being trafficked, not the traffickers.”

CAIN: “Right.”

Paul: “The other question nobody seems to have asked — one more question — nobody seems to have asked, this outboard boat was 2,700 miles. How do we know it was coming to the U.S.? So they may be selling drugs to Trinidad. Is it our job?”

CAIN: “Well, we are the in destination point for whatever percentage of drugs coming out of Central and South America.”

Paul: “Maybe. You don’t think anybody in the Caribbean is using drugs? What if they’re selling the drugs in Trinidad? Are we now the police for Trinidad? Are we going to blow up every boat? It’s just insane. You can’t blow up any ship that you think might have drugs on it.”

CAIN: “What I want to say, Senator, is — I always get this rap. It happens with Democratic politicians a lot. Here it is with a Republican politician. I’ve been told I got to go to commercial break several times. I do want to say this: I appreciate your fidelity to limited government and the Constitution. I think the differentiating factor here — I’m going to have to leave it here — is they’ve been designated a foreign terrorist organization and they’re importing a chemical that’s killing tens of thousands of Americans.”

Paul: “But not by Congress — not by Congress, by the president. That’s not constitutional. Under the Constitution, Congress must declare war.”

CAIN: “We’ll continue this conversation, I hope, Senator. Thank you for your time.”

Paul: “Sure.”