69. Tom Haviland and the Fibrous Clots

Today I talk with Ret. MAJ Tom Haviland. He is an engineer and when he saw the movie “Died Suddenly,” he was concerned. He then developed his own survey for embalmers to take. We hear his results today.
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69. Tom Haviland and the Fibrous Clots
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Nurse Kelly: [00:00:00] Welcome to after Hours with Dr. Sigoloff, where he can share ideas and thoughts with you. He gets to the heart of the issue so that you can find the truth. The views and opinions expressed are his and do not represent the US Army, d o d, nor the US government. Dr. Sigoloff was either off duty or on approved leave and Dr. Sigoloff was not in uniform at the time of recording now to Dr. Sigoloff.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Thank you for joining me again. Uh, I first wanna give a special shout out to all my Patreon supporters. Thank you so much for, for helping and donating and helping me in that manner. I wanna thank Shell. I wanna thank Sam and Angela Sheey at the $20 and 20 cents level that they've self-made.

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Dr. Sam Sigoloff: I truly appreciate it. It is, it has been very helpful to help these coming and you know, I truly appreciate all the support and, and the prayers and you know, if you're interested in getting one of my patches, I still have those for sale and I have. I've got some stickers for sale also. Uh, these are just decals that you can stick anywhere, that it's legal, you're legally allowed to stick these things.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: This one's kind of hard to see, but it's, it's the same patch just in the subdued colors. Uh, again, all of this is to help me with my legal fights. I've spent over, well over $60,000 in legal, uh, fees so far. Plus I have had a $10,000 grant on top of a $10,000 grant on top of the $60,000. Uh, this is a big fight, um, not a physical fight, obviously for all the CI agents out there, but a, um, Legal fight, right?

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Everything needs to be done legally, properly in, uh, [00:02:00] with no vigilante justice or anything like that. Uh, but the tide does seem to be turning. All right, so today I have a very special guest, and so his name is Tom Haviland. And. Tom is a retired major from the Air Force, and he's worked in various sectors.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: He's an engineer, uh, by trade. Um, he's worked in some, um, in some different, how do you, how would you say that?

Tom Haviland: Just different program offices, aircraft program offices.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: He's retired. Retired back in 2009. Uh, Sitting around at home. He saw this, this past Thanksgiving. He saw this one movie, and there's been a lot of controversy over this.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: I have some friends that were in the movie. Um, I was not in the movie, I was not involved in the movie at all. It's called Died Suddenly. And in that movie, um, you know, some people are quibbling that, oh, well it, you know, it's not a hundred percent completely accurate. Well, it was pretty accurate. Okay? So the amount that may not have been inaccurate, may have been inaccurate was maybe 1%, maybe 10% or less.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: What they des described and showed was very [00:03:00] accurate for what we are seeing. And um, you know, there's, there's always the detractors that say, oh, well, you know, this one little video of someone collapsing may not have been accurate. Okay. But what about the overall overarching theme of the entire video was correct.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: And so, Tom, when you were watching this, what happened?

Tom Haviland: Well, you know, when it first started, it's about an hour long documentary and about half of the film is, uh, devoted to. These embalmers that are seeing these strange white, fibrous clots. But when the movie first starts, they start off showing like Bigfoot in the moon landing.

Tom Haviland: And I, I said, what's going on here? So, but you know what? I decided to stick with the movie and I'm glad that I did. It's about, uh, 13 minutes and 15 seconds into the film. An extraordinary statement is made, Dr. A, uh, embalmer from the state of Indiana. Mr. Wallace Hooker, who owns his own funeral home there was lecturing at an Ohio Bomber's Association conference in Columbus, Ohio on the 26th of October in 2022, just a couple months [00:04:00] ago.

Tom Haviland: And during that lecture, it was a three hour lecture, he was speaking to a room about 100 balm. . And at one point he showed photographs of these white fibrous clots that he's been pulling out of his corpses for about the last year and a half when he first started seeing them. And he asked the audience of a hundred bombers, have you been seeing these white fibrous clots?

Tom Haviland: And he said, almost all of the 100 embalmers in the rooms raised their hand. Yes, they are seeing these white fiber clots. So then the next question he asked him is, well, when did you start seeing them? And the whole group agreed that it started about 16 to 18 months. In the middle of 2021, which is about six months after the vaccines rolled out the Covid 19 vaccines.

Tom Haviland: Is it a coincidence or is there some kind of correlation? You know, who knows, right? But it is kind of suspicious. So I thought that was an extraordinary statement, regardless of, like you said, what happened to the rest of the movie, and there were some problems with the accuracies in the rest of the movie.[00:05:00]

Tom Haviland: That statement is either true or it's false, right? Either those 100 revolvers raised their hands or they didn. So I went to bed. This came out the week of Thanksgiving and it was the a Monday, the week of Thanksgiving. I got up the next morning, Tuesday morning and I said, you know, I bet you. Uh, journalist in America is gonna follow this story and find out what's going on.

Tom Haviland: So I decided to do it myself. I live in Beaver Creek, Ohio, which is a suburb of Dayton, Ohio. It's about an hour north of Cincinnati, which is where the headquarters for the Ohio Bombers Association is. So I called them and I talked to their secretary and Mr. Dan, uh, David Hicks. I talked to their president of Mr.

Tom Haviland: Dan Becker, and I talked to their second vice president of Mr. Woody. And I asked them, did you happen to be in the room at the time that Mr. Wallace Hooker said that he, uh, asked this 100 bombers to raise their hands? And they, he said that they did. Unfortunately, none of the three of the three gentlemen happened to be in the room at the time, but the last gentleman, Mr.

Tom Haviland: Woody Wilson, [00:06:00] the second vice president who owns a. Um, funeral home up in Marysville, Ohio, about an hour north of me. And he also, uh, does his own embalming. A lot of funeral directors do with their own own embalming as well. Mr. Woody Wilson, uh, said that, Tom, I've been seeing the white fibrous clots. So I said, wow.

Tom Haviland: You know, here's confirmation, right? I've met a guy who's seen these white five verse clo. So I wasn't sure where to go from there. Uh, Dr. Sam, so I, first thing I thought about is maybe I should contact my state attorney general. So, you know, he's the highest, uh, office, uh, law enforcement officer in the state.

Tom Haviland: He, you know, Kind of controls all the sheriffs and the sheriff count and, and the counties, 88 counties in Ohio. And I, and I, uh, wrote an email to him saying, I don't know if there's a crime that's been committed here. I don't think there is. But we have a situation where we may have these 100 bombers that are part of this, uh, Ohio Embalmers Association.

Tom Haviland: That are seeing these white fibers, clots, but [00:07:00] nobody seems to be speaking out about it publicly. Should you do something about it? Should you investigate? You know, should you call the Ohio Involves association, get a roster of everybody attended, and then, you know, do some investigation. Find out, get them on the record as to scene whether they see these clots or not.

Tom Haviland: unfortunately crickets, Dr. Sam from the State Attorney General's office, nothing, no response. I finally, eventually got a response just saying, thank you for your, for your SU submission to us. And that was it. There was no nothing like, you know, we're gonna act on this, we're gonna do anything. So I said, oh, great.

Tom Haviland: You know, so the next thing I said, well, what, what should I do now? Well, uh, multimillionaire Steve K. , who actually I think was the inventor of the optical mouse and made millions and millions of dollars because of that and has, has been involved in other corporations. He, when the whole vaccine, uh, COVID vaccine thing came out and he started to see injuries with it, he actually left his multimillion dollar job and decided to start a vaccine [00:08:00] Safety research foundation.

Tom Haviland: And he posts a CK article, uh, every day and. , I decided to comment on one of the CK articles with this information that about, you know, talking to the, the three officers at the Ohio Bombers Association and, you know, getting one of 'em to say, yeah, I've seen the white fiber clots. Uh, there was about 800 comments that CK article that day and what was interesting is there was.

Tom Haviland: And I put my co my own contact information in the combat. I put my email address and my phone number, uh, and I got one call. I got one call from a young woman up in Northeast Ohio, not too far from where I live. Uh, and her name was Laura Kasner. And Laura, uh, eventually it's, I don't know if it's coincidence or not, but she happens to be an expert in SurveyMonkey, an online survey tool you can use to, you know, to conduct surveys wherever you want to.

Tom Haviland: That's exactly what I had in mind. I wanted to do a survey [00:09:00] nationwide to try to corroborate these six or seven embalmers that were in the movie died suddenly that said they were seeing these white fibrous clots. And also, you know, maybe try to get some of the Ohio embalmers and other embalmers from around the nation to come forward and say, and yes, we're seeing these two.

Tom Haviland: So that's what we did. We, uh, I created, uh, a, like any good reporter, you answer the question. Who, what, where, when, why, and how. I left two of the questions out. The who, because there's a little, there's a sanctity to the embalming room. You don't like to talk about the dead, and you know by name. Also the involves themselves.

Tom Haviland: I could sense that they were a little leery about wanting to answer a survey with their full name, so we'll, I said, we'll, we'll allow them to answer the survey anonymously without knowing who they are. But you know, knowing maybe what state they're from, we'll ask 'em what state they're from, but that's it.

Tom Haviland: We won't ask them for their name or any, I. Identification. The other question, uh, embalmers are not really qualified to answer is [00:10:00] why, why these clots are forming. You know, they're, they're just embalmers. So the questions I focused on are, what, what are you seeing? Are you seeing these fibrous clots when, you know, when did they start, when did you start seeing them?

Tom Haviland: Where, where in the body are you finding these white fibers, clots? And then how much you know and what percentage of your corpses are you seeing these white fibers clots? So the survey centered around those four questions. I also asked a couple questions. One of the bombers, the Mr. Woody Wilson, who's uh mentioned earlier, the second vice President of the Ohio Bombers Association and a funeral home owner in Almer himself also said, Tom, I've seen an increase in the number of traditional jelly clot.

Tom Haviland: uh, they've, they've been around for, those are the one reddish in color r uh, called jelly clots, red jelly, great, great jelly clots or current jelly clots. And he says, I've noticed an increase in those as well actually starting in the year of covid. And then, um, uh, you know, increasing as [00:11:00] well in the years 2021 and 2022.

Tom Haviland: And I've also seen an increase in the viscosity of those. So I got the, it was about seven questions to the survey. got that all finished up and then I gave it to my assistant Laura to load into SurveyMonkey. So then the next thing I had to do, Dr. Sam, is figure out, well, how am I gonna distribute this thing?

Tom Haviland: You know, how am I gonna get it out to all these active embalmers all over the country? So I used a two-prong approach. I decided to use a top-down approach. I contacted by telephone the, uh, presidents of the 30 largest states in America by population. Uh, their, their. State Funeral Director associations.

Tom Haviland: So, uh, yeah, to distribute the survey to them. So I sent the survey and I put a link to it in the, in the email that I sent to them. And then, you know, they, these, uh, associations have hundreds of members underneath them. Ohio was kind of a strange case, but Ohio had actually two embalmer associations as well as a funeral director of association, [00:12:00] you know, the, the Ohio Embalmers Association, the Cincinnati that I mentioned earlier, and then an association of embalmers of Cleveland, Ohio.

Tom Haviland: So I sent that to them as well. But most states don't have that. They just have a funeral director association. So I sent it to, to those, uh, most populated 30 states. And I also used a bottom up approach. I actually went. On the web and I found the, uh, email addresses for over 800 funeral homes. So, for example, like in California, I sent, uh, the survey to funeral homes in the Los Angeles, San Diego, San Jose, Sacramento, San Francisco, Oakland areas, for example.

Tom Haviland: So we used this two-pronged approach, this, you know, kind of top down approach through the, uh, state associations to send down to their members. And then this bottom up, By sending directly to the funeral homes. So despite. Uh, sending out to all those, uh, addresses. We only got 128 responses, which I was a little disappointed with because I was preferring to get [00:13:00] something in the area of 300 or 400 responses to get a little bit more statistical significance.

Tom Haviland: But I still think that the 128 responses that we got, Dr. Sam are uh, a good enough to show a signal. Cause the interesting thing is, out of the 128 revolvers that responded to the survey, 88 of them said they are indeed seeing these white fibers clot. , that's 69%, 69%, almost seven out of every 10 of Bulmers responding saying they are seeing these white fibrous clots.

Tom Haviland: So that got my attention right away. The next question that we had in our survey was, uh, what years did you see these white fibrous clots? And I gave them the option of not one year, but you know, I gave them years, plural, at, on the survey. And on the survey we had the years 2018 through 2020. . So 2018 and 2019 I put on there control years, you know, before covid hit it at all.

Tom Haviland: And then 2020, of course is a year that we had the Covid [00:14:00] virus, but no vaccines yet. And then 2021 and 2022 as years that we had both the uh, covid virus and the vaccines. And the results were that the main consensus of the embalmers are that the clots, these white fibrous clot. started in the year 2021 and then continued into 2022.

Tom Haviland: There was a small amount, you know, that which would implicate the vaccines as a possible cause. Right? Uh, there were a, there was a smaller amount about a third of those involved. I saw the clot start in the year 2020. And my theory around that, in theory, that I've heard, heard other doctors, I'm not a doctor, but I've heard doctors talking about this, is that the code virus itself has a spike protein on the surface.

Tom Haviland: and that spike protein tends to form what's called amyloid proteins. Basically misshaped misfolded protein. that then can, can then, uh, be difficult to break [00:15:00] down in the body. We all have a, uh, enzyme called plasma that's used to break down internal clotting. You know, internal clotting could be good when your, your body's trying to repair a blood vessel, but then that clot needs to be broken down at some point so blood can flow freely.

Tom Haviland: Again. Plasma's used, uh, uh, is an enzyme in our body that does that for us, but it becomes difficult for the enzyme to attach to. Folded protein and these spike proteins have a, uh, from the covid virus, have a, have a tendency to, uh, form these misshaped misfolded proteins that then become difficult for the enzyme to attach and break it down.

Tom Haviland: My theory is that effect got supercharged in 2021, in 2022 with the introduction of the vaccines. Cause if you recall the vaccines themselves, you know, were supposed to stay in your upper arm, produce just a limited amount of the spike protein. And do it for a few days to a week or so, right? Just enough to elicit an immune response from your firm, your immune system.

Tom Haviland: But we know that's not what happened, right? [00:16:00] The shots go all over your body. The mRNA didn't stay just in your upper arm. And we've also, uh, discovered that the mRNA can produce the spike protein, turn your body into a spike protein factory. For months as opposed to just days or weeks. So my theory is, is that it's, it's helping to, you know, supercharge and produce more of these misfolded amyloid proteins that then turn into these white fibrous clots.

Tom Haviland: Now that's speculation, but you know, and more scientific research needs to be done. But I think it is a plausible theory, and like I said, several doctors out there have been touting that.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Yeah, let me, um, there's a couple things you said that I think are really good that I want to kind of hone in on. I, I really like how you took out the, the who, right.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Because I don't think embalmers have the HIPAA laws like doctors do, but you still wanna give that respect to the deceased and, and to the families and, and the why. I think that's very prudent to say, you know, you are not educated in d. And, and treatment. And, and so you, you really can't say why. And that's [00:17:00] not a dig at anybody in any stretch of the imagination.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: No. That is just,

Tom Haviland: they don't take it as one either. It's just they understand that's not their, that's not their job.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Uh, one thing that you had, um, said about there is an increase in the current jelly clots. So current jelly clots are just kind of these, these, like, they look like, like current jelly. It's, it's a food we always.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Things as food. They're reddish, strange color, strange things that doctors do. Yeah. Yeah. The kind of reddish in color, they're really, they're, they're like gelatin. And that's normal clots that we see, that we've been seeing since all of eternity. And, um, I think that the, so my theory is a little different than some other docs, but I think that the increase in the current jelly clots is, I would suspect that is from that spike protein that we're seeing from, from this virus or whatever toxin or whatever it is now.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: the fibrous clots that were seen. I, I don't think now I, I am happy to say that I could be wrong and I probably am wrong and we'll find out in the future someday. [00:18:00] Um, but I don't think that the, these fibrous clots are from the spike protein. I think they might be from the lipid nanoparticle, cuz so many people they.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: they, they have a different approach to this whole thing. They think it's the mRNA, which is bad and there's lots of evidence that it, we may not be able to do that technology like that. We think we may be able to, and we may not actually be able, but let's say we can. , that technology does exist and we are able to do what we think we can do with it.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: I think that is about 50% or less than the injury that's actually coming from these injections. And I think the majority of the injury is coming from the, um, lipid nanoparticle. So these are the, they call it cholesterol, and that's what they put into these things because they told us that the, the shot would go into the arm, it would go into the del toy, and it would.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: they've done a couple things since then, and I noticed this as the doctor going, well, they're not withdrawing when they're injecting anymore. And they've changed that across the board for all injections, which is a terrible idea because sometimes you could hit into a tiny, tiny, small vessel and you always were supposed to withdraw first.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: And [00:19:00] if you see a flash of blood, then you, you withdraw a little bit so that you don't inject, right? So you don't direct the, the injection directly into the vessel, which would take it into the, uh, the venous system and straight to. The rest of the body. Right? We don't want that cuz there could be particulate matter in there which could cause strokes and all sorts of problems.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: So they, they, that's one thing they changed. But this lipid nanoparticle, we know by some declarations that I made where I referenced specific patents. We know that these lipid nanoparticles, these long hydrocarbon chains, they call D, they cause D iic, which is disseminated intravascular coag. Now that would be a traditional normal clot, not these fibrous clots.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Uh, we know that it causes other problems in the body. We know. They put in D S P C and D S P E and D S P C and D S P E are specific lipid nanoparticles that were both patented at the same time to get medications through the blood-brain barrier. So [00:20:00] they never intended for it to stay in the arm from, from the word go.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: They lied to us from the start and that patent was believed from 2017. So it's, so some of it may. The mRNA and the gene technology, and there's also some people that think that mRNA and gene technology, we just, we're not that advanced. And if you look at the, the breakdown of, of these shots and this, this goes in particular to the people that say, oh, I got the, the dna, the one and, and done.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: It's not the mRNA. I don't know if that is the issue. DNA n a in itself makes me more concerned because it can go straight into your dna. N a, there is no intermediate, there's no reverse transcription needed. It just goes straight into your dna, n a. And a good example of that is chickenpox. If you get chickenpox once in your life, it goes into your dna, it stays in your DNA n forever, and that's how you get, um, shingles later in life.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Uh, so the mRNA DNA n a thing, I think those are not good arguments to say, well, at least it's not the mRNA. Well, but you had the dna. But I think the real [00:21:00] issue, the big problem is the bio weapon, which I think is the lipid nanoparticle and that may be causing these clots, these fibrous clots that are unnatural.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: And, and one thing that I think that, go ahead. . Well, one thing that, um, that you had mentioned on another show, this is the Daniel Horowitz show, um, is that some of these embalmers were saying that they, where they found them, they found them in the, the arterial system. Now, one thing that could explain that is these, these fibers clots may have happened after the person was deceased.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: but these clots are very unusual and, and there's actually video of people taking, of surgeons taking these fibrous clots out of. Arterial system and the venous system of living people. So it would make me think that these are probably all preformed before they were deceased.

Tom Haviland: I, I, I think there's strong information to [00:22:00] indicate that they are being formed prior to death.

Tom Haviland: Cause that was one of the arguments. Yeah. Is that one of the arguments is it was just blood coagulating after death. We know that's not true. They're white fibrin, fibrous structures. They've actually sent, uh, some off to a lab for analysis and they've come back, uh, saying that. There's very little iron, magnesium, or potassium in them.

Tom Haviland: You know, you talked about the red, uh, grape jelly clots earlier. Those have been around, like you say, forever. They're reddish in nature because they contain a lot of iron. Right? Blood normally has a lot of iron in it. These white fiber structures don't contain iron. That's why they're, they're not reddish in nature.

Tom Haviland: They're whiteish in nature. So we know that the, these white fibers, clots are not blood congealing or coagulating. So, so basically, What I did then is, uh, the next question I, I asked, like you say, is where in the body are you finding these white fibrous clots? And the two main injection site points for embalmers are the, uh, carotid artery in the neck.

Tom Haviland: Yeah. [00:23:00] And then all the, the iliac artery down in the pelvis that goes down then into your femoral arteries. So it's not surprising that the embalmers found most of these white fibers claws as they're trying to. Put embalming fluid through the system at the injection site, their main injection site point.

Tom Haviland: So the, uh, the main point that they found the clots was in the neck area is followed by the, uh, the legs. So the last question I, go ahead.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Go ahead. Um, I want to ask you about this real quick. Yeah. And, and if this wasn't specifically in there as a question, I don't know if anybody volunteered this. I spoke to a embalmer, uh, maybe a year ago now, and he was saying that typically he, he would only do in the carotid and in the jugular.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: And he, what they do is they, and I don't wanna get graphic too graphic, but I, I do have to explain some things. Think of these as tubes. And what they would do is they would, uh, cannulate the tubes or put something into the tube and they would. Fluid through it and it would come out the other tube. Okay.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: So go in the artery, come out the vein, just like normal circulation. [00:24:00] And typically they could um, they would just do one injection site. And what this embalmer was telling me, I was talking to him for a different reason and just, we just haven't been able to line things up to have him come on cuz he, his father actually died of Cretz Yakka, um, which, goes into that misfolded protein thing that you were talking about, which is a very interesting, very and terrifying thing.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: But so he, he said, normally we do one injection site and we can flush out the whole body, get all of the blood out, put the embalming fluids in there and it's fine. And he said, since he's noticed these shots have have started an uptick. He has to do five injection sites, so the head and neck, each arm and each leg.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Which, and he, it's because he, his reasoning is because there's so many of these fibrous clots in the arterial and the venous system that he can't get anything to pass through Now, couldn't have, could these have worsened after death? Sure. But there's a lot of evidence to show us that they didn't just worsen [00:25:00] after death, that they were present during.

Tom Haviland: r right. They're seeing them in fresh bodies too, not just, you know, bodies have been sitting around in, in storage for a while. And, and, and I did have several co I'll read you several comments of the end, Dr. Sam, that, uh, that talk about that. Yeah. There's, there was one embalmer who, uh, said it used to take me about an hour and a half to do an embalming, but now that's about two and a half hours.

Tom Haviland: Cause I gotta, I gotta keep stopping to try to pull these white fibers, clots out so I can get the fluid in. So, .

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: And if you could imagine your heart trying to pump against that, because these machines, I'm sure they can turn up the pressure on 'em, but eventually, like your heart can only go up so much in pressure and contractility.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: And so at some point something's gotta give.

Tom Haviland: So it is, it is not surprising that people might be stroking out or having heart attacks or, you know, getting embolisms with these white fibers, clots, maybe breaking loose and blocking a [00:26:00] critical pathway in a circulatory system. So it all kind of pieces together, doesn't it?

Tom Haviland: You know, the, the last critical question that we asked is, what percentage of your, uh, corpses are you seeing these white fibers, clots in? And that was an astonishing answer as well, Dr. There is a, uh, 57 out. The 128 in Bulmers that responded to the survey are seeing the clots in at least 20% of their corpses.

Tom Haviland: There were 23 individuals, uh, uh, in Bulmers that saw the clots in 21 to to 40% of their corpses. There was another 23 embalmers that saw these white fibrous clots in 41 to 60% of their corps. and there was even 10 in Bulmers that are seeing these clots in 61 to 80% of their corpses. Can you believe that?

Tom Haviland: I mean, it's shocking, isn't it? And one of the things we wanted to make sure in the survey, by the way, we were talking about the, the, the traditional clots earlier, they're the grape jelly [00:27:00] clots. And bulmers for years have also been seeing these things they call chicken fat clots. They've been around forever as well, where they're yellow.

Tom Haviland: Uh, they're smaller and they tend to tear very easily. They're totally different than these white fibers, clots that are large whiteish in color and very tough, very hard to break. So we made sure to make that distinction before we had the embalmers take the survey so they could, you know, they weren't answering thinking.

Tom Haviland: We're talking about, uh, chicken fat clots. Well, no, what we're talking about are these all new white fibrous clots. So it's, I mean, that's shocking the percentage of, uh, corpses that the uls are finding these clots. and it, and it correlates a little bit to, we know that 80% of Americans got at least the first two jabs.

Tom Haviland: I was on the C'S tracker site the other day, and, uh, uh, it was close to 80% of Americans over the age of 18, took at least the primary series. Now, fortunately, Americans, I think, are starting to get the picture because this latest omicron bib booster that according to the CDC c's, [00:28:00] uh, vaccination tracker site, less than, just less than 20% have taken.

Tom Haviland: Omicron Biva, booster of Americans over 18 years old. And, um, you know, that's, that's a good sign. It means the Americans, I think, are figuring out that the shots aren't working right. They're, they're getting shots, they're catching covid anyways. They're passing it to other people. They're hearing about things like myocarditis.

Tom Haviland: Right? And I'm hoping they, they may start hearing some more things about these white fibers, clots, cuz I think it's also a serious contributor to, uh, this, this die suddenly phenomenon that we're seeing going. .

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Yeah. One thing I would like to see if any of the listeners or viewers are able to do this, um, and it may be difficult to do, um, but do some sort of overlay map where, you know, specific areas, states or regions to see if there's more of these fibrous clots reported compared to areas that, uh, may have received some of those batches that.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: More related to injury or if there was a negative association, right? Because if people die as soon as they [00:29:00] get the shot, then they're not alive later to be embalmed, to have these fibrous clots in their bodies. Either one would be interesting.

Tom Haviland: Yeah. The unfortunate thing was there is, you know, we, like I said, we only got 128 responses, so we really didn't have enough data in order to do regionality.

Tom Haviland: Cuz if you think about, you know, I sent it to 30 states, so that means I only got on the average four responses per. You know, out of the 30 states I sent to, so that really wasn't enough to detect regionality. We did get responses from all over the country, but in the responses, and I'll tell you that in the responses we got, we saw, we from every single region we saw.

Tom Haviland: Responses said they were seeing the clots and those that said they were not seeing the clots. And we did the, we also looked for any kind of red versus blue bias. You know, I, like I said, I sensed this, you know, red states like Texas, Ohio, and, and, uh, Florida. But I also sent them blue states like California, Illinois, Massachusetts, New York.

Tom Haviland: And we didn't see, that was kind of refreshing. We didn't see any, uh, red, blue, [00:30:00] uh, bias because we. Uh, you know, blue states saying we saw the clots and those, those saying we didn't. And in red states we got those saying we saw the clots and those we didn't. But I rather do a more, uh, deeper study with, with um, with more data, with more responses, more deter, determine that regionality.

Tom Haviland: Cause I know several of the, uh, folks I talked to mentioned the same question you have cuz there were certainly some, it sounds like there were some hot batches, right? That were sent to certain places and those that were not. .

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: And one thing that I, I'm glad that you did this is kind of look at, um, states and, and their political views a little bit, um, because I was listening to Steve D once and he was doing a round table with, um, Daniel Horowitz and I can't remember who else.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: But one thing that Steve D had said was, you know, , could there be some mass? I don't think he used this, this is kind of my interpretation of what he said, but could there be some mass, um, formation around the shots? Right? So could certain states where you've gotta get this, I'm [00:31:00] gonna call it a sacrament because this is a religion.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Um, you have to get the sacrament and you know you have some mild injury from this, this sacred injection that they're putting into you. And I use that. Error quotes and lots of, um, ridicule. Um, and you, you have to put it in you. And let's say you have a minor injury, not a severe, where you're dead or severely IPA incapacitated afterwards, w would you be less likely because everyone around you is saying, this is the best thing ever.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: This, this is the only thing that's gonna save you. Everybody's gotta get their shots. Would you be less likely to claim that you've been injured at all? And I think that's very reasonable cuz peer pressure is a very significant.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Yes, it is.

Tom Haviland: And, and, uh, there's a professor, I, you've probably watched some of his videos. His name is Mattias Desmond. I think he's from Belgium. He's done some videos with, uh, from various, uh, uh, interviewers where he talks about this, uh, formation of mass psychosis formation where people get locked into, like you say, their, their, their [00:32:00] particular view and they don't wanna move off of it no matter how much evidence you show them.

Tom Haviland: To the contrary, it's almost as if it's a religion at that point. So, It's interesting you say that because I've noticed that myself. Uh, one of the things I actually did, this is kind of off the subject a little bit, but I, uh, was fired from my. Uh, defense contractor job, uh, in October of 2021, right after Joe Biden put out the mandates on the military, the, uh, defense contractors and the government civilians, and I refused to take the jab.

Tom Haviland: And, uh, the, our three star general of my Air Force base in Wright Paterson, Ohio sent out an email that I thought was kind of insulting to those of us who weren't vaccinated, trying to guilt us into getting the the shot. So I sent back an email to him basically, Uh, a shame on you instead of standing up for our right to decipher ourselves whether or not to get injected with these experimental drugs.

Tom Haviland: You chose to spend your time trying to guilt us into getting the jab shame on you. And I didn't just send the email back to the [00:33:00] general, I sent it back to all 30,000 people that work at Wright Patterson Air Force Base. Ohio. Ohio. Yeah. Wright Patterson is the, uh, largest single site employer of the state of Ohio.

Tom Haviland: And, uh, they pulled the, the email that I sent off the system fairly quickly, but it still got to thousands and thousands of people. And the reason I know that is, is after the. Incident, of course, about a half hour later I was called and I was fired from my $165,000 a year defense contractor job for, uh, shaming the general in front of everybody in the base.

Tom Haviland: But it was worth it because there was no, no colonels, no generals, nobody fighting back, nobody pushing back on the mandate saying this is wrong. To, to, to, you know, demand that somebody be injected with an experimental drug totally violated the num bird code, totally violated any. ethics, it actually violated the core principle of which this country's founded on, which is individual liberty.

Tom Haviland: Your decision to decide for yourself how you're gonna live your life. Amen. [00:34:00] Amen, Dr. Sam. So, but after that it happened, I actually, I stood out on a, uh, busy street corner for over 120 days with a sign saying, no vax mandate. During that time, I probably saw about a half a million cars go by me. It was, you know, had like four lanes of traffic each way, two turn lanes, you know, it was close to, yeah, it was close to a, yeah, close to a Walmart and uh, and a Best Buy and an Olive Garden and a Lowe's, you know, really busy area.

Tom Haviland: And it was close to the base too, which was nice. Cause I see men and women in uniform coming to lunch and things. So I'd stand out there during all from lunchtime all the way through. , uh, rush hour going home. And what I would typically see Dr. Sam is, uh, about 70% of the drivers would do nothing. They're either busy in their day or they don't care, or they're afraid to speak out.

Tom Haviland: There were about 20%, 20% who, uh, [00:35:00] liked the sign. He said, you know, gave me a thumbs up. Honk their horn, you. Waved at me. There was still that 10% though. These people that are locked into this mass formation psychosis Who said f you, you know, get the shot. You're killing grandma. Yeah. . So, yeah. And what was strange was, is over the, I I, I started holding the sign, actually before I got fired from my job.

Tom Haviland: I, I spent my summer vacation or vacation in September of 2020. holding the sign for two weeks in a row, and then I did it over the whole next year. In about every few days or so, I'd go out and hold the sign all the way through the fall of 2022. And the, that, that percentage never changed. You would think as more data came in about how the, how the shots were getting worse and worse and how people could see they were breakthrough cases and it, it wasn't stopping you from cashing it or transmitting it.

Tom Haviland: The, the ratio never really changed. The people that were locked in. to the mandates and getting the shot and loving the shot continue to do so [00:36:00] despite whatever information came out, you know, uh, against the, against the shots.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: That's something that's really interesting cuz that kind of corresponds with Milner and his experiment where, um, and if you haven't heard of it before, they actually did a pretty good movie on it.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: I think it was on Netflix. I don't think it was. Yes, sir. Uh, I don't think it was done by Netflix, but it was on them a while back. And the experiment was in the 1970s. And there's some ethical violations with this now, so they can't do experiments like this, but they, they had people come in and they had a guy in a white suit or a white jacket, white coat with a clipboard.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: And the person, um, was told that they were experiment, that the. Examining and watching the person that they were talking to, and they'd have this person answer some questions and they'd, you know, they'd be writing down and if they answered the, the person they answered the questions to that they couldn't see, but they could hear them.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: And if they answered the question wrong, they were supposed to give a shock. And before they started the. , the whole experiment. They put the shocking device on the person who was asking the questions. He was [00:37:00] actually the, the, the person who was being evaluated, um, without their knowledge. And they gave him a few shocks and showed him how when it got stronger, this is what it would feel like.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: And so they, they knew. What it felt like. You know, at first it'd be like a snapping of a, a rubber band, and then it would get more and progressively stronger with every wrong question. The shock would get stronger and it would get so bad that the guy that they couldn't see that was, um, answering the questions wrong on purpose, that he was getting such a strong shock that he was screaming and pleading, please stop.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Please stop. I have a medical condition. Please stop. And then he'd stop screaming and they would still deliver the shock, all because. Position of authority. There was a person in a position of authority standing over them with a white coat and a clipboard, and about, I think it was about 10 or 20% stopped and said, I'm not doing this.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: You're crazy. I'm not doing this. And that's about the same percentages that you're seeing, which is interesting that there's something different about that, that small percentage. But that's the same amount of percent. that made this country that [00:38:00] went against the crown that made this country, that's the same percent that that will save this country again.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: And I think it's interesting that while you were standing on a street corner, Holding a sign. I would've loved to have seen that. That would've been so encouraging to me. Cuz I was back in September of 21. That's right. When I was first suspended for medical practice, for giving out exemptions, um, to service members.

Tom Haviland: God bless you by the way, for doing that. That took a lot of courage from your partner. I knew that. You knew you were putting your career at risk by doing that. Yes sir.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: But just like you, like, you know, you can't force. It's my body. It's this whole, it's my body. It's my choice. This truly is my body that doesn't involve anyone else's body, and it is my choice.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: And I choose not to put a bio weapon into my body, especially when they lied about the lipid nano particles, how the lipid nano particles are dangerous, how they have incomplete, uh, safety data sheets, meaning the Secretary of Defense was in violation of his own Doty dod instructional of exposure in the workplace.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: And, and I applaud you, sir, for giving a big, [00:39:00] um, Single finger salute to this general.

Tom Haviland: My, my goal was if I could get a few people, especially like moms or dads, not to jab up their kids, you know, if I could get one mom not to jab up her child, then I consider myself successful. and I'm, I'm hoping that I did sway people because I didn't, I didn't just have the sign.

Tom Haviland: I also had a megaphone and I would, you know, spout out, you know, with when the cars were stopped, if their windows rolled down on a nice summer day, I say, Hey, did you realize, you know, Rochelle Lewinsky and Joe Biden, his wife and Dr. Fauci all got four shots and they still got the covid anyways, then they took Paxil Vid and got Covid two weeks again later.

Tom Haviland: You know, so you throw those kind of facts at 'em and it just makes it sound silly. Why are you continuing to get these shots right? So I would, you know, And every week new information would come out about how something getting is wrong with the, with the, with the jab. So it wasn't hard for me to get

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: information.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: And one thing I also want to make sure I mention, cuz obviously the, this jab, and I don't call it a, a vaccine cuz it's not, it's a bio. It is a bio weapon. And the bio weapon is covered [00:40:00] under E Uua emergency use authorization. A couple weeks ago, I went to the dentist's office to get my teeth cleaned. They said, Hey, sir, there's a mask over there.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Go ahead and put that on. I said, no, I choose not to enter into your experiment. I'm like, huh, what? And so eventually it led to the. officer in charge of the clinic, the OIC, to come out, talk to me. This Lieutenant Colonel Dennis, and I explained to him how under 21, USC 36, uh, B BBB dash one and 10, USC 1107 Alpha, it's illegal, unlawful for him to tell me to use, uh, a product that's under emergency use authorization because the surgical mass under a.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Under e u a. And so I have to accept all the risk if I do that. And I don't accept any of those risks and I choose not to. And then the other argument is, well, I could use a cloth mask. No, because it's not a medical device. It's clearly not a medical device. It's not gonna stop anything. Well, why would I use, uh, surgical masks that also will not stop anything as the best surgical mask we have are N 95 s and they can stop [00:41:00] 0.3 microns, which is pretty small.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: the virus is half that size at 15 microns, so it whis through both directions and never stops.

Tom Haviland: God bless you for being, uh, non-compliant. Getting back to our survey admitted, like I said at the very end of the survey, like so, so the three main points by the way is, like I said, seven out of 10 in Bulmers are seeing these wifi verse clo. You know, like I said, 88, 88 out of the 128 respondent said they're seeing the clots.

Tom Haviland: The, uh, consensus from the embalmers is that the clots, uh, first started in the year 2021 and continued into 2022, which suspiciously implicates the vaccines. And then the third big one is that, uh, in bulmers are seeing these, uh, white fibrous clots in some up to 50% or more of their corps. So that's a big deal, right?

Tom Haviland: Those are so, and the next thing I wanna know or wanna do is actually try to get this information to all the. people like, you [00:42:00] know, thank you for helping me, uh, platform to get, get this information out. I'm trying to get it out to as many people as possible. Eventually get it to the c d C and f d I actually requested that I'd be able to speak today.

Tom Haviland: There was a meeting that's taking place today at the f fda and they're given one hour for, uh, oral presentations. I actually requested to speak. They're given each speaker three minutes to. So 20 speakers. So I was gonna condense my, uh, surveyed results and, and give a three minute speech on this.

Tom Haviland: Unfortunately, I was not selected as one of the speakers. They had a lottery and I did not get picked, but I did submit a written package with the results of my survey, you know, imploring them that this needs immediate investigation. And you, you, you, you. You think about, well, will the f FDA and C D C take any action based upon the actions they've take in the past?

Tom Haviland: It's kind of, Hmm. So, you know, I've also, uh, I think another step needs to be taken is maybe, uh, put this in front of Congress and I'm, I'm actually in favor of putting a moratorium, a ban of, of five years on these mRNA injections [00:43:00] until big pharma can prove to us that they are not. Uh, unsafe because I think there's so much information out there that that proves.

Tom Haviland: There were definitely some major problems with this, that we need to say, stop and not do this any anymore until they can prove to us that these, uh, that these injections are, are safe and effective. , which I, I believe they're neither , and

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: I would agree with you wholeheartedly with the low caveat of let's not narrow it down to mRNA.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Let's try and keep it wide with the lipid nano particle, because they're gonna start putting those into your traditional flu shots, your m m, uh, Mr, and all your childhood shots, because that, I believe that is the bio weapon te. .

Tom Haviland: I see. Okay. So that's that's a good point. You know, and if congress, you know, Congress doesn't always, uh, do what we wanted them to do either.

Tom Haviland: So I think that, you know, the last line of defense is you, right. You have the option of educating yourself. Of deciding whether or not you want to take these injections or not. [00:44:00] I've, for myself, I am definitely never taking any of these injections and so, you know, if, if all else fails the last line of defense or is the American citizen themselves.

Tom Haviland: At the very end of the survey, we gave the embalmers an opportunity to provide comments if they wanted to. And what's interesting is in the survey we never mentioned the words covid. We never mentioned the word covid vaccine. In terms of these, all, we asked 'em about these white fibers, clots is, you know, are you seeing them?

Tom Haviland: When did you see them? Where on the body did you see them? And, and, and what percentage of your corpses are you seeing them? We never mentioned covid vaccines or covid itself, but despite that, we got quite a few answers from embalmers that talk about the vaccines. So let me read a couple of 'em to you, Dr.

Tom Haviland: Sam. Here's one from. I've seen clotting coming from most any of the points I of incision. I mainly embalm in common carotids, and I've seen many white fibers, clots about the [00:45:00] same time the vaccine came out. I've also seen an increase in CO since covid for the jelly clots. Here's a naysayer comment from California.

Tom Haviland: I've never seen any white fibers, clots, or any increase in grape jelly clots. Not sure what you're getting. Do you believe this is vaccine related or something? I've embalmed over 500 people from 2020 to now, and I've never seen any of this. Here's another one from Ohio. People that were covid confirmed had bad great jelly clots.

Tom Haviland: It was early 2021 when we started seeing the white fiber structures being pulled out of both the veins and the arteries, like you said, the, you know, um, Uls typically find these, uh, fine clots. The, the, the traditional grape jelly ones and these, uh, chicken fat clots, um, that are also been common for forever in the veins.

Tom Haviland: Primarily. They usually, very rare that they find any in the arteries, but they're starting to find [00:46:00] these white fiber structures in the arteries as well. So he is go, to, go on, he says, prior to 2021, we never pulled a clot from an artery. I just pulled a white structure from the right common cortid y.

Tom Haviland: Here's another one from Missouri. The clots look, uh, like large night crawler worms. They're usually very long. They kind of branch off from the main clot. I started noticing them after the Covid vaccine came out. I've been embalming for the last 13 years and have only started seeing these cloths for the last year, or.

Tom Haviland: Here's one from Arizona, another naysayer one. I have seen zero changes to the presentation of human remains in the last few years. It is clear that this is a poor attempt at farming anecdotes to malign the Covid vaccine. Please don't do this or claim that any anonymous survey data is any sort of substitute for rigorous scientific.

Tom Haviland: And this proof, by the way, [00:47:00] that I didn't, uh, I didn't discriminate against any answer, right? I kept all the answers to the survey I got. I trusted the integrity of the embalmers, taking the survey to tell me the truth of what they were seeing. And like I said, I threw no answers away. I kept everything, all the data that I, that I got.

Tom Haviland: Here's another one from Idaho. My clients have had the Covid vaccine, have passed of Covid and have remarkably more clot. So much so that I began to ask families if their loved ones have had the vaccine. So he's one of the few that's done that most embalmers don't because you know, it's a time of grief for the family and they don't want to add any emotional pain by asking a, a question that's very controversial, like, Danielle, did your deceased loved one get the vaccine?

Tom Haviland: So I can understand why in Bulmers, you know, tend not, and they don't usually deal with the, uh, the family as much anyways. Right? It's the funeral director who runs the funeral home that usually deals with the. Here's a really strange one. This is the scariest thing I've seen in the last [00:48:00] 20 years. I worry every day if me or my family have them growing inside of us.

Tom Haviland: That's from an embalmer. So he's actually, you know, you see he's getting freaked out, right? He's doing these embalmings, he's finding lots of these white fibers, clots in his corpses, and he's wondering what's, you know, obviously he had the vaccine, must have taken the vaccine, and now he's worried about what's happening inside his.

Tom Haviland: Here. I'll read you one last one here from Ohio. Some of the fibers. Cloths were six to 80 inches long, six to eight inches long, and almost impossible to break with forceps. That's how tough these are. So that I read you about eight uh, responses there. Six of them said they were seeing the clots and then two naysayers saying they were not seeing the clots, which was about the same ratio that we.

Tom Haviland: You know, in the answer to that, the question about, uh, what percentage are seeing the clots? So I think it's definitely a signal. I think it's definitely, it's, uh, Houston, we have a problem here, and that further investigation needs to [00:49:00] be done to see what's going on with these white fibers, clots, and if they are linked in any way to the covid 19 vaccines.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: I think it's, it's wonderful what you've done here tonight. What I particularly love about this is that you're not in the medical profession. You are a lay person, and that what that means is anyone can do what you did. . You don't have to be some, someone from an ivory tower of a medical community to go. I wonder if you can just start wondering if you don't need permission to wonder if, and, and you can set up the infrastructure to get good answers and Sure.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: This is not, you know, randomized controlled study. Right. We'll never have those for this. . And, and you had mentioned that it was maybe a coincidence that you, I don't think they

Tom Haviland: wanna run 'em, do you? I, yeah. They, they don't wanna run. They, they're, I think Dr. Ryan Cole says it best. He says, basically, it's gonna be hard for you to find a problem if you don't go looking for it.

Tom Haviland: Right.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: And if you're walking North Blinders, you can't see Period. , you'll never see the problem. You'll never see the answer. You'll never see anything. [00:50:00] Um,

Tom Haviland: but I wa I was curious. I I wanted to know the answer, you know, and I'm, and I'm a data geek, I guess I'm a math major from Ohio State. I have an electrical engineering in engineering degree from Louisiana Tech.

Tom Haviland: I, I've, I worked with the whole 36 years I was in the Air Force and worked as a defense contractor with the Air Force. I. Data. That's, that was my job on a daily basis, you know, as an engineer. So I'm data driven and, uh, it was a fun project for me, but, uh, but unfortunately it's given me an alarming answer, which I think definitely needs to, uh, to be further

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: researched.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: And what I want everyone who listens to this to think, how can you know if you're interested in this fight? You're like, well, I'm, I'm not a doctor, I'm just an engineer. Well, this is what you can. This is how you can help in this fight. And again, this is, this is not a physical fight. This is not vigilante justice.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: This is, these are numbers fights, these are fights for the human mind, for, for the kingdom of God. That's what these are. And I, we haven't talked about this. I don't know if you're, um, a believer. Um, most people that [00:51:00] I've run into, um, have a spiritual faith of some sort, and most have been Christian and the other maj, you know, smaller majority have been Jewish.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: I haven't run into other faiths. Um, But this is a battle in the unseen realm. This is a battle for your mind, for your heart, for your soul. And, and what we need to do is have everyone understand that and stand up for God's kingdom and, and gain that ground. And this is not a physical fight. This is a fight over the hearts and the minds to, to win people over.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: And for those that have had the shot already, there's forgiveness at the foot of the. There is, or whatever religion you are. Every religion that I know of has a way of redemption and forgiveness. But in Christianity, which I am and I, I advocate for, I, there's redemption of the foot, the cross. All you have to do is, is ask for forgiveness and believe in Jesus.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: And that doesn't mean you won't go through hardships. That doesn't mean you won't have the consequences of your earthly decisions. [00:52:00] doesn't mean that you have to live with that same decision for the rest of your life with, with that, that burden on your heart.

Tom Haviland: I agree with you completely. Uh, you know, the, um, vast American public, like I said, 80% of the people got the first two shots and most of them did it out of the goodness of their heart because they wanted to protect themselves and, uh, not get others infected.

Tom Haviland: They, cuz they were being told if you got the shots, you couldn't transmit it. You know, we couldn't catch it or transmit it to others, so I'm not gonna fault anybody who got the shots because I, I think the vast majority of people did it out of the goodness of their hearts. It's unfortunate they were lied to that, that, that those that were uh, administering the shots knew that they would not stop you from catching covid or transmitting it before they even rolled the vaccines out.

Tom Haviland: And that's unfortunate that to, that they duped the American public. I'm also, it's, it's a little disappointing that people so quickly abandoned their God-given immune. To, you know, to, to automatically have faith in the authority of these, of these [00:53:00] manmade shots. So I totally agree with you that, uh, there's a spiritual component to this as well, and that we, maybe this is a good wake up call for people, right?

Tom Haviland: That now they. Trust a little bit more in what God has provided for you. You've got a great natural immune system. Don't damage it by getting these shots. If you've already gotten these shots, don't get any more. And even if you haven't had any problem, maybe you got the shot and most people got the shot and haven't had any symptoms, haven't had these adverse side effects, but that doesn't mean you, it can't happen in the future.

Tom Haviland: There's a good chance if those people got, are, are feeling fines because they got a dud. You know, the, the, these shots had to be stored at very low temperatures in order to keep the mRNA active. And it's quite possible that, you know, you saw these long summer lines of football stadiums with, you know, cars lining up, people getting their jabs.

Tom Haviland: Maybe by the time you got your jab, the mRNA went in. And, and lipid and, and, you know, basically you got some sludge put into your arm that was, that didn't, didn't even do the job it [00:54:00] was supposed to do, but you can count yourself as a lucky one for that because it didn't turn your body into a spike protein factory.

Tom Haviland: So, uh, I, I, I totally agree with you, uh, Dr. Sam, you know, pray about it, um, and, and trust a little bit more. Your God-given natural immune system, it's worked for man for centuries and it'll continue to work.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: And there's one other thing that you mentioned that I think was very interesting. You said maybe it was a coincidence, maybe it wasn't.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: But that, that, that lady that you're working with, um, I think you said she's from northeast Ohio. What's interesting is, and this is from listening to a rabbi, um, he is a podcast that I listen to, used to listen to pretty regularly, and he said that the word and the idea of a co. Is not in Hebrew, meaning that idea and that word does not exist in God's language.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: So really that idea and that word shouldn't exist in our vernacular because it's not a coincidence. It was a divine

Tom Haviland: appointment. She found me in a sea of about [00:55:00] 800 comments to that sub article by Steve krs. For her, and it was way down on the bowels of the comments. She just happened to be scrolling all the way in, you know, deep into the comments and saw my comment.

Tom Haviland: I'm, I'm with you. I don't think it was coincidence. I think it was God's hand work to give me the assistant, the, the tool that I needed to somebody who knew Survey Monkey that were allowing me to, to, to, to make this thing happen, to make this survey happen and go nationwide. So I count my blessings every day and she's a good friend and, uh, we've, we've got a close relationship.

Tom Haviland: Because, because of this, and we've, we both fee

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