61. Commanders Call Part III, Former LTC Ret. MAJ Chris Berge

This is Part III in a four part series. This series all about highlighting true leaders. These four leaders that I interviewed are the example of what a leader truly is. There are two types of leaders in the military: Assigned and emergent. Through sacrificing their assigned leadership position they have now become emergent leaders. History will look back with awe on these leaders that refused to go off the cliff with the rest of society. All of these four leaders have at least one thing in common, they have built the foundation of their life upon the solid Rock of Jesus.
Today I talk with Former LTC and now Ret MAJ Chris Berge. Chris was an Battalion Commander at Fort Hood TX. He refused to give the order for his soldiers to take the COVID-19 gene therapy. He also refused to take the gene therapy.

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Next week please join me as I talk to LTC Allen Cohen. He is in the Air Force and was billeted to be the commander of a unit. However, due to exercising his right body autonomy he was removed from that position.

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Show Transcript:

61. Commanders Call Part III, Former LTC Ret. MAJ Chris Berge
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Nurse Kelly: [00:00:00] Welcome to after Hours with Dr. SIgoloff, where He can share ideas and thoughts with you. He gets to the heart of the issue so that you can find the truth. The views and opinions expressed are his and do not represent the US Army, d o d, nor the US government. Dr. Sigoloff was either off duty or on approved leave and Dr.

Nurse Kelly: SIgoloff was not in uniform at the time. Of recording now to Dr. Sigoloff

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: okay. All right. Well, thank you for joining me again. I wanna first thank my Patreon supporters. We've got Shell at the $50 level. We've got Sam and Angela Shucky that just recently increased their, their monthly commitment from $17 and 76 cents a month up to $20 and 20 cents a month.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: We've got Perry at the $17 and 76 cents a month. Kevin and Katie, Joe, pj, Ty, uh, Rebecca, Amanda. This bets nasty. Thank you so much for all of your support. I truly appreciate it. And everybody who's been able to get out and get one of [00:01:00] these patches, uh, I think one of someone just bought 12 of of them just recently.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: So thank you so much. I truly appreciate that. I think that's gonna be some Christmas presents. Uh, I do have more available. I can only put up about 48 at a time, uh, mainly for my shipping department and my wife to be able to keep up with it. Um, and then we can put some more up. We've got a total of about 475 of 'em that I'm gonna be selling.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Um, and we're maybe. Halfway through that, or a little less than halfway through. Thank you so much for all your support. It's been, it's been a wonderful outpouring of blessings y'all have been given. Today we have Chris Burge. Chris Burge is, is a man who, who definitely deserves to be in this series of relieved commanders.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: So he, he was the battalion commander of the 1 3 90 fifth. It's a brigade engineer battalion at Fort Hood. Thank you so much for joining us and, and tell us what happened, what your story is.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Hey, Dr. Siegel. Uh, first of all, thanks for, uh, having me on, uh, longtime listener . [00:02:00] First time caller. It's, uh, great to be on here.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Um, yeah, hey, I, I thought I would share, uh, with you my two parts, my personal experience, uh, you know, my, my own medical and religious, uh, accommodation request. The issues that I had with, uh, Re receiving the shot. And then also, um, my, what I would call my professional experience, the, the issues that I had, you know, as a battalion commander, uh, with forcing a shot on, on my soldiers, um, you know, whose health and welfare that I was charged with, with entrusted ent, trusted with.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Um, . So my, my personal experience, the, uh, the medical medical exemption process, um, I, I got a couple medical stuff, medical issues that, uh, that I didn't, didn't exactly feel comfortable with, uh, taking the shot and, uh, made the medical, uh, request. for the shot, and, uh, it was [00:03:00] denied. And, uh, there, there are some things that I had heard from several doctors who, uh, weren't, weren't the ones that the media were, were always going to, they were more the alternative media type, uh, source folks.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Uh, they were saying some things about the shot that, uh, kind of lined up with, um, things that I had personally and, uh, I wasn't willing to get them. Get the shot. And, um, the, the medical community with the military was, um, eventually quick to deny that request up at the, um, you know, the Pentagon, Pentagon level.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Um, and so I, I made the, um, made the second request and that was denied as well. Uh, so pretty. Quick and dry with medical exemption. Uh, my religious accommodation request, there were several arguments that I made with the religious accommodation, um, you know, fetal cell line, which is very important, but that's, uh, kind of a boiler plate that everybody [00:04:00] goes to, which, uh, you know, if you, as I, as I dug into some of the research in the shot, um, I, I learned actually a lot about some of the other things that, uh, use fetal cell lines, which.

Former LTC Chris Berge: It's actually changed some of the things that I, I use as well. I'm, I'm going to use in the future when I need it. Um, but if, if people haven't thought about that, uh, I think it's important to think about. And, um, so that's one. Uh, and then the other, the other one, uh, I've got two others. Uh, transhumanism was really important.

Former LTC Chris Berge: I really think that, uh, transhumanism is. , uh, an angle that, uh, people who are pushing this kind of technology, mRNA technology onto us. Um, yeah, transhumanism was important for me. I think that, uh, you know, according to like Psalm 1 39 we're fearfully and wonderfully made by God. And, um, and so the, [00:05:00] I'll, I'll tell you, when you look at, uh, Moderna's website, um, Actually, I looked at it last night and they changed it.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Uh, when you looked at it along, uh, several months ago, it would say something to an equivalent of like, Moderna is, uh, like tweaking the operating system of life or something like that. And, um, and so, yeah.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Yeah. So I think you and I know what train, what transhumanism is, but I don't want to assume that every listener also knows it.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Can you describe what that means to you or what the definition actually

Former LTC Chris Berge: is? Yeah, yeah. Since we're in this modern age of, uh, discovering what it means to me, , um, yeah. Transhumanism is basically like, uh, basically improving hu humanity, the, the human. And, um, you know, I don't, I don't subscribe to, um, evolution and, uh, you [00:06:00] know, I'm not necessarily judging people if they do, uh, If you do the, a lot of these people, they do subscribe to evolution and they believe that they can improve hu humans, uh, that they can become part of the, uh, the, the default evolution and, and improve humans in that way.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Um, . So I, I don't, and, um, you know, I'm, I'm, I'm, I guess you could say I'm an antit transhumanist. Uh,

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: I think one thing that's important, I think one thing that's important to add to this is if you don't believe us or you don't understand, please go look up Yuval Aldi. Yuval Aldi is part of the World Economic Forum, and the things he says are absolutely terrifying.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: I don't have any clips available of him right now, but what he said is, , we will hack the human brain soon. He'll say things like, where you won't have freedom of choice. And then he talks about his investors and how they're the most important. And it, it's people like, [00:07:00] you know, these big tech companies, I'm not gonna mention any names specifically, but these big tech companies that had these cloud systems, almost as if it's an artificial super intelligence that wants to be able to take over the thought content of your.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: and connect you to computers. And then we hear certain people like Elon Musk who's working this angle called Neurolink. Well, the reason he's doing Neurolink is so that humans and computers can be connected. He's got a different angle. He wants humans and computers to be connected so that when computers become aware, they see humans as, oh, they're part of us.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Let's not kill them all.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: And, and that's not being fantastic at all. That's exactly what he. . Yeah. Must. Exactly.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Uh, you know, one of the crazy things is, uh, you know, computer can only, uh, Dr. Sigal, you remember, uh, you remember the cassette tapes back in the nineties and whatnot. Uh, [00:08:00] I, I don't know if you remember those. I, I don't know how old you remember that.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Please call em Sam to Sam. Sam, uh, you know how you could take recordings of. of the, uh, cassette tapes. Well, you know, eventually if you recorded a cassette tape off of each other, eventually it would, it would get, the quality would be so bad you wouldn't understand what it says. Uh, you know, kind of the same with, uh, making photocopies, um, humans can't improve upon, uh, themselves and, and the way of like, uh, moral values, uh, it is.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Uh, we can only create something, uh, if you can even create something as good. Um, so where we're entering scary time, where we, um, we think that we can create something that has, um, greater moral, um, ascendance than, than, than we can then and we're becoming kind of our own gods in that sense. Uh, it's, it's gonna be very [00:09:00] dangerous in that sense.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Yeah. So, . Yeah. Transhumanism. Uh, and the, the last argument that I wanted to talk about, um, for why I didn't want to take the shot is, uh, the Imago Day, uh, you know, talks about Genesis, the first chapter that, uh, God created man in his, in his own image. . And, um, this is really similar to transhumanism, but it's just, you know, very slight shade of great difference.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Um, you know, by, by me taking something, uh, that would improve what God created, I'm essentially saying that God could have improved me. And, uh, so, uh, God didn't do things correctly. And, um, so. Uh, basically it's would be changing the information at the cellular level and, um, you know, I talked about the operating system earlier.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Uh, you know, Microsoft has, um, I believe has been in court cases and [00:10:00] Microsoft went and appreciated. If I went in and changed their operating system, I'd probably have a lawsuit on my hands. Um, you know, kind of the similar argument with God. God created me fearful. I'm fearfully and wonderfully made. Um, , you know, who am I to, uh, go in and change his operating system, change how he made things.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Um, so, um, yeah. And then, you know, the other thing is it's basically overriding the purpose of, and the, the design of the cell God's design. And I'm not willing to do that. So that was, that was my personal, personal experience. And, uh, you know, I got, And as we've talked, I've got a couple things with my professional experience as well.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: One thing I wanna add to that real quick is some people seem to think that for it to be considered gene therapy, that it must go into your cell and then into your nucleus, and then change your dna. N that is a completely false idea. [00:11:00] So the F D A. Um, made a definition for gene therapy back in 2018. Um, and the definition means that that's part of the definition.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Or it could mean you introduce some genetic material, dna, RNA that changes the function. It alters the, the biological function properties, the, it alters the biological properties of that cell. So if you put a gene into someone, whether it be mRNA or dna, and it doesn't go into their nucleus, and it just goes into the CTools floating around and it gets expressed well, you have treated that person with gene therapy.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: That is, by definition, the FDA definition of gene therapy in 2018. That is gene therapy. But now we know that it, it can. It can change the d n a of a human. So I just wanna make those distinctions. And even though we, we use that term, it, it is the correct term. It is absolutely the correct term.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Yeah. Yeah, exactly.

Former LTC Chris Berge: So, you know, about a year ago, uh, and [00:12:00] earlier in 21, Um, you know, I was talking to medical professionals that were in our unit and, and outside, and I was like, Hey, you know, one of the issues that I have with this is, uh, here, here's this study. There, there is a study, there was a study back in 21 and 20 that talked about how, um, the mRNA technology could, uh, possibly, uh, you know, basically like reverse transcript, transcribe, uh, in the cells.

Former LTC Chris Berge: And I presented that study and they were like, ah, no, that, that. , that doesn't happen. I studied this stuff and we're good. And, um, you know, it's like, okay, I got one medical professional and another medical professional one who's done research and, uh, at least one who's done research. And, um, I'm just, I'm not willing to roll the dice like that.

Former LTC Chris Berge: And then lo and behold, like you said, you know, you got studies coming out where six hours later the, the liver cells are, are actually ch, the DNA and the liver cells are being changed. Uh, so, you know, once again, uh, theory proves fact with this stuff. [00:13:00] Um, yeah. And you know, the other thing, you, you were talking about the definition of, uh, gene therapy and it interesting how they had to change the definition of a, of a vaccine.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Um, you know, from something that elicits the immune response to, uh, you know, this thing goes in and actually changes, like I said, changes the function of the cell. . Yeah. Not in not improving my system. Um, yeah, yeah. Pro professional experience. Uh, you know, I, I didn't have any problems with, uh, my soldiers getting the shot if they wanted.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Um, I'm, I gave every a ample opportunity for them to, uh, at least know that if they had a, any religious beliefs at all. Um, cuz you know, you look at the regs and you look at, uh, what's said if, if you have any religious belief, , uh, it doesn't even have to be a recognized religious belief system, then, uh, you should, you should, um, be able to register, [00:14:00] uh, as for a religious accommodation request with, with different things, you know, the seeks, uh, want to wear their head, uh, their headdress and whatnot.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Um, they, there's several who have gotten religious accommodation requests for that. Um, I remember over at Fort Hood, there were several soldiers that I saw. We're growing beards longer than mine, uh, because they were, uh, uh, what is it? Pagan. And, you know, all I wanted to do was just not get this shot because I had religious, strongly held religious views against this.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Um, but anyways, I, I gave my soldiers ample opportunity for medical and religious, um, accommodation requests. And I didn't have any issues with, uh, saying, Hey, this is a legal, uh, order. Uh, until I started reading the documentation and I started looking at the Pfizer Bondek and the community fax sheet. And if you read that pretty closely, I haven't looked at it, um, you know, since like, uh, [00:15:00] August, September, October timeframe last year.

Former LTC Chris Berge: But it, at, at least at that time, if you looked at it closely, uh, there was an asterisk at the, at the footnote. And it said, Hey, uh, by the way, uh, these two are similar in makeup space, but um, you know, they're legally distinct. And I'm not a lawyer. Uh, I don't claim to be one, but, um, when I read that, my reading comprehension said, Hey, you know, this seems like they are legally distinct.

Former LTC Chris Berge: And so I started talking to different folks and they're like, yeah, I don't know what that means. Anyways, I, I had one, one NCO who, um, didn't want to get the shot. And, you know, everyone was under the gun to be, everyone was racing to be number one. Uh, I wasn't necessarily racing to be number one on to get everybody, uh, get their shot, but, [00:16:00] uh, everybody was racing to, to.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Everybody complete, uh, so that they can see that they're number one and they're supporting everything. And I have one NCO who was holding out and uh, I was giving them as, as much time as, as I could. And, uh, I went to 'em and I said, Hey, uh, Sergeant so-and-so, um, I, I know you don't want to get the shot. And, um, uh, you know, are you sure that you don't have re any religious beliefs against these?

Former LTC Chris Berge: Like, no sir. You know, he is very intellectually honest. Uh, are you sure you don't have any medical issues? I'm like, no, sir. I was like, okay, uh, well let me, uh, I just wanna show you what, what we want you to get. And, uh, I ga gave him that fact sheet and I showed him, uh, you know, I was like, here it is. And you see where it says it's legally distinct.

Former LTC Chris Berge: He said, yes, sir. And I was like, okay, well you ready to go get your shot? And he said, yes, sir, I am. Uh, so I took him over to the, uh, the Fort Hood, um, shop [00:17:00] clinic area. They had a whole. before this, uh, port Hood's a pretty big, pretty big post and, uh, there don't too many people there because, you know, it's coming near the end, uh, where everybody had gotten their shot.

Former LTC Chris Berge: And, uh, Sergeant so-and-so went up in line, filled out the paperwork, and, and they said, okay, what are you here for? And he said, uh, well, I wanna get the shot. I want Coer. And they're like, oh yeah, hey, I'm sorry. Um, we only have Pfizer Biotech and we have the other ones, um, Moderna and. Was, I can't remember what the other one was.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Johnson Johnson. And I said, yeah, that, that's great, but, uh, I want community. And he said, okay, I guess, uh, you're, you're not gonna be able to get the shot today. He said, okay. He said, but, uh, our nurse oic, uh, will be here tomorrow morning. And so we said, okay.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Yeah. When, when you were there, did you see physicians, were there many physicians around or was it mostly nursing staff?

Former LTC Chris Berge: Yeah. None that were, I mean, [00:18:00] none that I could readily identify. There were lots of nursing staff and

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: uh, yeah, because, and I bring this up just because yesterday I was looking through some. It's, um, 15 six investigation stuff against me and there is a clear and present conspiracy, and I mean that by the true definition of multiple people, more than two people conspiring or plotting against me, a doctor, the medical director at the time, using, you know, these nurses using their, their guesstimation of what medical knowledge is saying that I'm wrong with my medical.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: and how those four nurses came together and went to the commander, who is also a nurse. So it's, it's interesting, um, that's why I asked that question.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Yeah. Well, don't five nurses, uh, you know, be the doctor or something. I don't know.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: and, and it's, this is not a dig against nurses. My wife is a nurse. I think nurses are amazing, but everyone has to have their own place.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: You know, like a nursing education is not the same as a physician's education and vice versa. There's things [00:19:00] that nurses know that I don. Sorry, I didn't mean to distract you there. Sorry.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Right. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, exactly. Yeah. And there are things that you know that nurses don't, but I will also tell you, um, and I'm not saying this is the case.

Former LTC Chris Berge: I mean, you can go do research on your own and you know, there are a lot of us who. , you know, Sam, there are a lot of us who are more informed than the people that are pushing this stuff. So, yeah,

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: I wanna wholeheartedly agree with you. I have met more people that know more about this than most doctors on the face of the earth right now.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: And I feel like the Army has encouraged people like you and most people I've interviewed to go basically go get their self-directed PhD in law medicine and in the pharmaceutical companies. And I, and I wanna applaud you and everyone for doing the research that you've. because now you've made yourself an expert in this, this part of the, of life.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Yeah. I wouldn't, wouldn't call myself an expert. I just, um, you know, little bit [00:20:00] of, uh, preserving my autonomy here, , like being a human . And, you know, I, I, I joke, uh, about that a little bit, but, uh, you know, if, if folks have gotten the shot. , you know, that was their own decision. That should have been their own decision.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Um, you know, I, I don't, I don't knock people for getting it if, uh, they've gotten it, uh, wanna respect people who, who've gotten it. But, uh, for me, you know, people shouldn't, it shouldn't be pushed on people. Um, because I, I do believe that, uh, it's violating. If they don't want it, it's vi it's a violation. So, um, yeah.

Former LTC Chris Berge: So, uh, I, we. Sergeant so-and-so to, to the clinic to go get a shot. They didn't have it. They said the nurse who I see would be there in the morning. Um, so, you know, I'm, I'm kind of wanting to come to ahead with this. So I show up in the morning with, uh, my NCO and, uh, [00:21:00] we go and talk to the nurse o ic, uh, oh oh five types.

Former LTC Chris Berge: So, uh, Lieutenant Colonel, we went and talked to her. She, she met us, um, as we came in and. Sergeant said, Hey, uh, I, I'd like to get cer. She said, well, unfortunately we don't have that available. And I, I hadn't said anything at the whole time, uh, that, that we, we'd done this. I've just kind of been in the background.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Um, you know, just nobody. And, and at this time I'm like, Hey, um, you know, my name's Colonel Burge. I'm this battalion commander. He's my last soldier who, you know, either doesn't have a, an accommodation request or hasn't gotten the shot. And so I'm, I'm here and. I'm just trying to help the process here. Um, so I understand you guys don't have community and, and this is the one that, uh, the sergeant wants, um, are, is it possible for you to just put that in a memo format saying that you don't have community?

Former LTC Chris Berge: And she looked at me kind of like. , this is kind of an odd request or you know, like, okay. [00:22:00] And, uh, but she, she obliged and said, sure, I'll go ahead and go, go do that. So she, she typed out a memo. It was pretty short saying, Hey, you know, we don't have, uh, Pfizer Bondek, all we have is community. I said, Hey, thank you so much.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Appreciate you doing this. Uh, but um, I'm wondering, you know, also putting that in there that all you have are, uh, you know, the e U a vaccines emergency use authorization authorized vaccines. And she again, you know, another look like, geez, what are you, what are you doing here? Um, but she, she, uh, you know, fulfilled my request.

Former LTC Chris Berge: She said, yeah, I, I, I can do that. So she ran back in and retyped it and said, you look. Here's the memo. Uh, you know, I, I don't have the, uh, the, the header, the title paid part of the, of the memo, but, um, here it is, and, uh, please don't, don't, uh, show this to anybody. And I'm like, don't show this to anybody. You know, why?

Former LTC Chris Berge: What's the purpose of even putting it on paper if I'm not gonna show it to anybody? Um, but, uh, [00:23:00] obviously she felt like there was something wrong with what she was doing. , but, uh, at, at least, you know, from what she was said, what she was told to do, um, and she's, she was like, yeah, but they're all, they're all the same anyways.

Former LTC Chris Berge: And I was like, okay, I, I got it, but you know, I'm a commander and I need to do right by the soldiers. So, uh, hey, thanks a lot. Appreciate it. And we left. So, um, so I had the memo and, uh, you know, I needed, needed to be able to inform my chain of command. So I, I went right over to my brigade Jag. , I was like, Hey, captain, so-and-so, lawyer type, um, you know, all this, all these big legal words, I just don't understand what they mean.

Former LTC Chris Berge: And uh, I took this memo to 'em and I said, here's what's happened. I don't know what everything means. What do you make of it? And this captain lawyer type looks at the paperwork. He's like, oh, wow. Someone actually put this on paper. I was like, yeah, I [00:24:00] know. It's crazy, isn't it? Someone put this on paper.

Former LTC Chris Berge: What do you think? Wow. And, uh, wow. He said us, sir. I, I'm just, I don't know. I'm gonna have to look at this,

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: so I bet his face was melting off . Yeah.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Yeah, cuz you know, you and I both know that the ethical dilemma that's going through this young captain's mind and, um, you know, the, I just turned his good day to a bad day and, um, so I, I asked him how much, how much time does he need to look at this paperwork?

Former LTC Chris Berge: and debate, ethical dilemma. Um, so I showed up like two, two days later and he is like, uh, sir, I don't know what to make of it. I was like, thanks, . So I, I took, took the paperwork and um, I, I went, went from his office, went to go see my brigade commander. I'm like, Hey, sir. Um, , you, you already know I got, you [00:25:00] know, the personal issues with, with this stuff.

Former LTC Chris Berge: So, um, here's this paperwork. What do you think of this? And I was like, Hey, look sir, I, I, I have an issue. Uh, I'm going to have an issue. It wasn't even time to really enforce the, the shot stuff with this. Um, we, we still had several months and I said, here, here's Sergeant so-and-so's stuff. Uh, I just wanna let you know that, uh, here's the fact.

Former LTC Chris Berge: uh, from the cdc. Um, I'm not making this stuff up. It shows that it's legally distinct. You know, there's, there's a line between the two, and he is like, ah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Uh, look, the, the lawyers have already blessed off on this. We're all good. And I'm like, uh, I understand the lawyers, sir, and again, I'm not a lawyer, but it says that they're legally distinct.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Um, oh yeah. You know what? And I said, well, okay sir, I'm gonna have issues with enforcing this. When it comes time, he's like, ah, you know what? You are gonna have issues. And I said, okay, I just need to, to talk to a [00:26:00] lawyer who can tell me what the definition of legally distinct means. What does this mean for the two shots?

Former LTC Chris Berge: Said, yeah, you better go talk to a lawyer. So I went, uh, I went to another lawyer, anybody who could help me decipher what legally distinct means and. this lawyer over on post, uh, an office that, uh, anybody can walk into. I walked in, I said, Hey, here's my peer, my paperwork with these certain hi hieroglyphics.

Former LTC Chris Berge: And, uh, I said, what, what does it all mean? I'm so confused. And again, they said, wow, this is interesting. Someone put this on paper. And, uh, I know. I was like, what? What does it mean? And they said, You have a strong case. I was like, okay. Got it. Case for what, what does that mean? Yeah, yeah. For, for saying that these are legally distinct and, uh, you have a strong case, but in the end, uh, DODs gonna win because they're, you know, the big dog.

Former LTC Chris Berge: And [00:27:00] I was like, okay, I, I got, so

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: they, they knew exactly what you had. You had a, a golden ticket that's gonna torch all of them. They knew that. And they're heming and Han going, Ooh, yeah, this, uh, This doesn't look nice because they were shocked. That's someone actually put it on the paper. That's

Former LTC Chris Berge: that, uh, there, there was something there.

Former LTC Chris Berge: There's a, there, there, yeah. Yeah, exactly. Uh, there was something there. Yeah. So, um, but no one wanted to say, Hey, you've got something here and this is right and this is wrong. And, uh, so yeah, that, that was the beginning of the end.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Go ahead. Do, do you still have that document? And can you, uh, send a redacted copy?

Former LTC Chris Berge: Uh, yeah. Oh, and I'll, yeah, I can

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: do that. Post it here, if that's all right. Yeah. So we can see what we're,

Former LTC Chris Berge: yeah. It it, what you're talking about, it does look a little wonky because it doesn't have, uh, the head, the header, you know, the, the unit Sure. And everything she said, I'm sorry, I'm not the [00:28:00] hospital. I don't have my computer.

Former LTC Chris Berge: So here's. , here's my memo. So it looks like here's

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: a napkin with me writing on here that I'm . Yeah, exactly.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Yeah. Looks like a kindergarten would put it, but, uh, , um, you know, anyways, direct commissaries, um, .

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Hey. No, you're right. You're absolutely right. You are a hundred percent right. . I re Yeah, I resemble that remark.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: That's something I would do. .

Former LTC Chris Berge: Yeah. Yeah. Back when we used to wear berets, they'd wear bere. You're like, oh. Yeah. Pierre. Yeah. . Yeah. Anyways, enough making fun of direct commissioners. Um, yeah, so, uh, that, that was the, that was the beginning of the end. Uh, the, the, the next day, uh, pretty close to closed business, got a text saying, Hey, come on over to my office.

Former LTC Chris Berge: And, um, went over to my brigade, commander's office and I was suspended, uh, never to talk to my soldiers again, uh, except after. Finally cut [00:29:00] and, uh, I was, the next week I was removed from command and, uh, and then I, you know, went left enough. The service after that.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Did they relieve you? Did they relieve you for not getting the shot or for not forcing this sergeant to get the shot or did they distinguish, did they actually say, yeah, for me,

Former LTC Chris Berge: Yeah. So for me it was, uh, not going along with the program with, um, basically forcing, uh, uh, I can't remember the exact verbiage in my gomar. Uh, it was basically unwilling to support the chain of command. Um, yeah, basically unwilling to support the chain of command with their illegal orders. Right? So, you know, again, I'm not a lawyer, but no one could tell me what legally distinct.

Former LTC Chris Berge: So it's very difficult terminology to figure out. Um, so[00:30:00]

Former LTC Chris Berge: yeah. Yeah. Um, yeah, you, you know, um, the, the whole process has been, uh, there's been a lot of soul searching, uh, through the whole thing. Um, you know, I know anybody. going through this, uh, like, like yourself. I know, you know what I mean by this? Uh, I've grown a lot through the whole op opportunity. Um, and it, it really boils down to what do you find your identity in?

Former LTC Chris Berge: Um, and you know, I, I find my identity in, in Jesus Christ. And, um, you know, my, my priorities have, have always been, uh, ever since I was a young lieutenant, I've always been, uh, God, family and then work or career. And, uh, you know, career was getting in the way of, uh, family in this case and career was getting in the way of, um, my, my relationship with God, uh, foremost.

Former LTC Chris Berge: So [00:31:00] I, I wasn't willing to cross the line in that. And so this was really a, um, an issue with identity. And, you know, I think. , uh, I, I know not everybody. I don't want to, I don't want to paint with too broad of a brush, but, uh, many people, uh, in the military find their identity in, uh, rank. Many people find their identity in position.

Former LTC Chris Berge: And, uh, so I was not willing to, um, you, you know, um, go against, against where I found my identity. . And at the end of the day, you know, as, as a, as a tax paying citizen, I have to, uh, ask myself, you know, is, is the taxpayer really getting their value with this vaccine? Um, you know, especially as more and more information rolls out, uh, we learned that, uh, you know, the vaccine was ineffective.

Former LTC Chris Berge: We learned that, uh, and more and more. So every day undeniably we're learning [00:32:00] that. The vaccine is wrecking havoc on, on people's bodies. Um, you know, as, as, as more and more data comes out on that. So, if, if I were to ask a question though of, of leadership of, uh, higher ups, I'd, I'd ask them, uh, you know, the hypothetical question of, uh, the flu vaccine.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Um, hey, so at what percentage do we stop pounding our soldiers to get the flu vaccine? and you know, as, as a commander and you know, as a soldier under plenty of commands, I think, you know, it was around 85% around that area. You know, if, if every unit had 85%, then you know, supposedly we were protected from the flu, even though everyone still got the flu pretty much every year.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Um, so where, where are we in comparison with the flu vaccine? , um, you know, they are hounding, they're, they're throwing people out for, you know, being the 0.0 1.1 in a, in a unit that doesn't have the vaccine. [00:33:00] Um, we're way over 85%. And, you know, make, make no mistake, the federal government has. Put millions of dollars, put an astronomical amount of money into every single private that's come into the military, let alone every officer that comes in as a second lieutenant or an oh three as a, as a direct commission, e uh, put tons of money, millions of dollars into, into us.

Former LTC Chris Berge: And they're just throwing it away just because they don't, they don't, especially now they're still continue to do it. Um, if you don't get this, this shot that's outdated because, It's you, it's off of the alpha or the whatever form, form of the, uh, covid. It's, it's

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: nuts. What's interesting about that is I haven't had the flu shot in two years now and nobody cares.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: There is no fight there. Yeah. But you don't get this one shot. That's not effective. It's not safe. It's not for the current strain that's going around. It's under e u a, which makes it illegal under 10 [00:34:00] US 10 U USC 1107 Alpha, which was ruled upon by, um, was it, uh, judge Sullivan in about 2004 or five in the Dovers Rumsfeld case.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: And I've been able to sit with Doe and I've been able to talk to Delran quite a bit. And, and so like for you and for me, sir, they're, they're breaking the, On law that's already been judged upon. It's not like this is precedence for you and me, for everybody who was in at that time that law, that order was for you and for me.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: And they're breaking that law.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Yeah. Yeah. It's, um, it's crazy. It's crazy. And, you know, one of the, the best thing that we can do as, um, best thing that we can do is just become informed and, you know, listen to podcasts like this, like your podcast, uh, , you know, don't, don't take everything that, uh, that's being said on a podcast for for sure.

Former LTC Chris Berge: You know, for, for truth, you know, look it up yourself and, and become informed. You know, I, [00:35:00] you know, the last thing that I'll, that I'll say, Sam, is, um, you know, I don't need everybody to be convicted on this, you know, with what I'm, I'm convicted on. But if, if you are convicted, then you know there's gonna come a time.

Former LTC Chris Berge: you know, just like my CG at the time when he called me to tell me, uh, hey, I'm not gonna support your religious accommodation request. And I really, really respected him for giving me a call. He didn't have to tell me anything, but, uh, you know, one of his battan commanders, um, it was a phone call and I said, Hey sir, you know, I really appreciate you calling me.

Former LTC Chris Berge: I really do that. That's very kind of you. You didn't have to do that. Um, but I just want you to know that, uh, you know, at some point in time they'll cross your line as. , um, you know, we, we all should have lines, and if we don't, then, then we're just, uh, you know, we're, we're welcome Matt. Um, at some point in time, they're gonna, they're gonna cross everyone's line.

Former LTC Chris Berge: And if you're not convicted now, just remember when [00:36:00] you do become convicted, you need to know where your line is and when it's crossed, you need to stand up and, uh, and not back. And, uh, you know, count the consequences, but regardless of the consequences, um, you know, our nation was built on convictions and, um, you know, my, my Christian faith, you know, convicts me.

Former LTC Chris Berge: It admonished me, admonishes me to, to take a stand. So here I am.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Tell us about the situation, about you getting out, because there was some controversy and some things that I would say are not right, and hopefully you can be restored in this situ. .

Former LTC Chris Berge: Yeah. Yeah. So, um, because I had received bad paper, I'd gotten the, the gomar, the general officer memorandum of, uh, administrative reprisal.

Former LTC Chris Berge: I think that's what it stands for, the gomar. Um, my, my file, my retirement file automatically goes to what's called a Grade Determination review board, uh, gd, r b and um, the GD r [00:37:00] b is a, uh, it's a board made up of. A number of officers that are, uh, senior to you, and they look at your file and from your file, they determine whether you served honorably, uh, at the greater rank that you're requesting to retire at.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Excuse me. So, um, my file went before the G G D R B. And, uh, that those, either those officers there, there's the board, and then there's also a, uh, I believe a political officer that, uh, like an ses or a senior executive service member, uh, who is politically appointed, uh, they, uh, sign off on the final one. Uh, I have yet to do a foia, uh, which, you know, now that I mention this, I hope they don't burn all the documents of my, my board files and stuff,

Former LTC Chris Berge: Um, but, uh, Either the officers or the political appointee, uh, said that, uh, I needed to be reduced in rank. [00:38:00] So, uh, you know, I used to hold the rank of lieutenant Colonel and then, uh, upon retirement, uh, I, they were, I've demoted to major. Um, so

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: that's shocking. Hang on just a second. Yeah, that is, I want everybody to, how many years did you serve?

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Uh, 20 years And some change. And how did you enter the service? Through enlisted or direct commission.

Former LTC Chris Berge: I went to service as a

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: second lieutenant and you gave 20 years of service and you made the grade and rank of lieutenant Colonel. And as you went to leave and retire, they said, that's not good. We're gonna bust you down to major because that's the last time you serve what we say, quote honorably.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: I want everyone to hear that and think about. They have promised him over his entire life that you will get your high three, the, the average of the highest three years of payment. You'll get a percentage of that. You'll get all of these, these benefits, you'll get to be, call yourself [00:39:00] retired, whatever your last rank was, and they took that away because he didn't wanna get the shot, he didn't wanna force others to get the shot.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: He, they took that away from.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: It's

Former LTC Chris Berge: terrible. Yeah. And you know, Sam, it's a, it's a, it's travesty. Um, and it's not something that I, I think about every day. Uh, not anymore, but, uh, thankfully I don't, like I said, I don't find my identity in it. And, uh, it is a wrongdoing. It should be corrected. And, uh, hopefully it will be, uh, you know, the crazy thing.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Uh, another, another crazy thing, , a lot of craziness going on here. Um, I, in my packet, my brigade commander that actually, um, requested that I'd be relieved and my, uh, the chief of staff that I worked under after I was relieved until I retired, uh, they actually gave me memos that said that I served honor.[00:40:00]

Former LTC Chris Berge: Um, a as a lieutenant colonel, I served honorably through battalion command, uh, through my time of battalion command. And, um, and, and that, uh, you know, I, I, the, the A actually looking at the regs, it shows what the G D R B is supposed to look for, you know, dereliction of duty, um, you know, any ethical or more ethical issues or anything like that.

Former LTC Chris Berge: And they wrote in their memos, you know, Hey, none of these issues. And somehow this board or this political officer was able to see through my one piece of paper that said, you know, showed that somehow I, I served dishonorably even though you had 2 0 6 s that said that I served honorably, one of them being my brigade commander.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Um, so somehow they had enough evidence. Everyone that said that looked at that was like, ah, don't worry about it. Your, your packet that goes before the grade determination review board. There, there normally has to be, uh, an investigation or something like that before they reduce you. [00:41:00] And there was no investigation done.

Former LTC Chris Berge: All it was, was this single piece of paper. And, uh, I, I believe, I believe there have literally been people who have. Gone to court for kidnapping and have not been reduced in rank yet. Uh, you just want to uphold the autonomy of your soldiers. And, uh, you know, hey, we, we all, when we sign the line, we all give up some, uh, some rights, uh, some certain rights, uh, with joining service.

Former LTC Chris Berge: But, uh, our bodily autonomy is not one of them. And, uh, we should not have to give that up. I think that's a great point.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: We do potentially lose some. Some free speech. If it's in the realm of political speech, we might not be able to, to say everything that we want to say, but we certainly do not lose our human rights because those are a gift from God, not a gift from government.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: That's why the Constitution and the Bill of Rights is so important is because we do not have a government that gives us rights. We have a government that protects [00:42:00] our rights.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Exactly. Exactly.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: I wanna, I want to thank you so much for, for taking the stand for, I think it's really important what you said is, and, and this idea that your identity doesn't come from your position in life in this world, because we're not of this world, and if our identity comes from God, then that gives us the power to give up everything in this world and to

Former LTC Chris Berge: follow.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Yeah, absolutely. You know, if, uh, if you're out there and you don't know, your identity seems like there's a lot of, uh, confusion with identity nowadays. It, it's, uh, something you should figure out. Um, cuz we're gonna be, we're gonna be pushed from a lot of different angles in the future. .

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: And one thing that I've been hearing a lot of lately from [00:43:00] different avenues is when you hear the Holy Spirit speaking to you, you get up and you move and you do what he says.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: And, and the reason is if you don't, if you delay, if you so, If, if you delay and you don't do what he says, you could find yourself in a very bad position on this, this earth, like, like maybe even a potentially immediately imminently dangerous position. And so to be able to listen to the Holy Spirit and to do that, then you first must be close enough to God to be able to, to listen.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: And I encourage everyone at this absolutely is the time to, to make sure that you're where you're supposed to be to, to listen and to listen to that.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Absolutely. Yeah. Um, y you know, if, uh, if you don't, if you don't know what the Holy Spirit's voice sounds like, um, you know, it's like hearing a new voice. Um, yeah.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: And it's not, it's not always a, [00:44:00] and it, that, that Holy Spirit voice is not always like Sam, you know. , don't take the shot. It's not always like that either.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: It's, it's this feeling that you get inside. It's, it's this, and, and, and you. You measure that, right? You, you go, okay, does this align with what God says in the Bible? Does this align with what other believers that I know that does all, do all these things align, right? Because usually it's, . It's something that goes along with what's in the Bible.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: It's usually something that you don't want to do often. God wants us to do things that we don't wanna do. Think of Jonah. He did not wanna go to Ninevah. That was an uncomfortable place for him to go. He didn't want to do it. But why does God call us to do things we don't want to do? It's so that we grow, right?

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: If I never go to the gym and I never pick up a bar, that's the shirt is ar and bars. If I never pick up a bar and I do, I never do something. Can't do or haven't done, or is uncomfortable to do, then I never grow. My muscles and my body don't change. My neurochemistry and my brain doesn't [00:45:00] change when God ha this whole earth is a gem.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: In a sense that God puts us here so that we can become the full potential that he's designed us to be, so that we can reach his other children. We can bring them and encourage them and help them make courage more contagious.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Exactly. Yeah, we, we survive every day. We live every day, uh, you know, through God's grace and, uh, and having faith.

Former LTC Chris Berge: And, uh, God gives us faith through his grace every day. That's, that's the bread of, of, that's the bread that we get every day. And, uh, you know, living, living through that faith. You know, I told you I wouldn't have, I've, I may have told you I, I wouldn't have changed things, uh, that, that have happened, um, would've changed.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Maybe one thing I didn't, I didn't appreciate being demoted, but you know, that's, It's a good gut check. It's like, Hey, you know what? That's not what my identity's in. And um, so, um, I I, I've grown, I've grown a lot, and I'll tell [00:46:00] you, uh, several of my friends who, um, we've one in particular who we're, we're both common friends with, um, we, we walk through this together, uh, calling each other very, very often.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Some really late, late night calls and. Uh, we, we have grown a lot, um, through this and, uh, as iron, iron sharpens iron and, uh, really, really appreciate his friendship. Yeah.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: And, uh, you know, I mean there's, there's a reason why we say a cord of three strains is not easily broken. And when a brother falls down, a brother can help him up.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: It's cuz we need God made. To be with others, you know? Yeah. Certainly there's some amen. Some introverts, some extroverts, whatever. But, but deep down, we, we need to have that fellowship with other believers so that we can help each other be strong and

Former LTC Chris Berge: courageous. Yeah. Absolutely. Absolutely. Did you get your pet?

Former LTC Chris Berge: I did, man. I really like it.[00:47:00]

All

Former LTC Chris Berge: right. How, uh, can I order a couple more on. Sure. You got, you got like a website? I

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: do. Um, I'll put the link. Cool. Uh, down below if I can remember. Um, I usually put it up in multiple places. Okay. In my telegram, my, um, Instagram, all those grams. Um, yeah.

Yeah, yeah.

Former LTC Chris Berge: That's

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: awesome sir. Thank you so much for joining me.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Thank you so much for sharing your story and. Thank you for being a leader, a true leader, not just one that's been appointed for leadership. Um, and thank you for, for following God and for choosing to be refined rather than just going along. Hmm.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Yeah. I appreciate it, Sam. Hey, thanks. Uh, thanks for the opportunity.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Uh, like I said earlier, I really appreciate what you're doing with, uh, with your podcast and, uh, appreciate this. Thank you, sir,

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: and we will [00:48:00] be praying for you.

Former LTC Chris Berge: Thank you. Likewise.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Just a reminder for everyone out there due to uniform of the day, the full armor of God, let's all make courage more contagious than fear.

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