Carl Sagan about education
Carl Edward Sagan was an American astronomer, planetary scientist, cosmologist, astrophysicist, astrobiologist, author, and science communicator. His best known scientific contribution is research on extraterrestrial life, including experimental demonstration of the production of amino acids from basic chemicals by radiation(Wikipedia)
Carl Sagan talks about the importance of education and the ability to question things, especially in science.
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Sagan wanted government to be the arbiter of Science. That is what we have. Sagan lead the way to get us where we are - not even a biologist can say what a woman is. Thanks Carl.
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Hi, could you please provide a link to the information in your comment? Thank you.
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I made several claims. Which one concerns you?
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It is about the arbiter of science. Additionally, how did Sagan lead the way you describe as a lack of knowledge about genders? Just links if you have. Simple curiosity. Regards.
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Thanks a lot. It is a courtesy answer because I need to digest your presented material. P.S. I guess that society and Government are not the same, is it? Regards, thanks again for the ability to use grey brain cells.
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Artaipray "It is about the arbiter of science. Additionally, how did Sagan lead the way you describe as a lack of knowledge about genders? Just links if you have. Simple curiosity. Regards." Some things we learn for ourselves. The are not taught to us. We do not read about them. We observe the world, and we learn. You want links, so I start with your video. I start with the words of Sagan. “we have arranged a society based on Science and technology where nobody knows anything about Science and technology and this combustible mixture of ignorance and power sooner or later is going to blow up in our faces. I mean who is running the science and technology in a democracy if the people do not know anything about it… Science is more than a body of knowledge it is a way of thinking anyway of skeptically interrogating that universe with a fine understanding of human infallibility. If we are not able to ask skeptical questions to interrogate those who tell us something is true, to be skeptical of those in authority, then we are up for grabs for the next charlatan, political or religious that comes ambling along. Jefferson…the people had to be educated and practice their skepticism and education otherwise we don’t run the government, the government runs us.” Let us get the messy stuff out of the way first. He has some wonderful thoughts and ideas in the last half – from “Science is more than…the government runs us.” Wonderful, great, lovely thoughts, we all agree. Put that aside for the moment.
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We need to discuss the lead. When he tells us “nobody knows anything about Science and Technology”, I assure you he is not speaking about Scientists. We should have no disagreement there. When he says “we have arranged a society based on Science and Technology” he is referring to our government. The structure of society is dependent on government. No government, no arrangement. Of course there is always society, but with no government, there is no arrangement, no social contracts. Next “who is running the science and technology in a democracy if the people do not know anything about it…” My answer would be – Science and Technology are running Science and Technology. Artists, are running the Art World. Musicians are running the Music world (not publishing) Each discipline runs itself, concerning its body of knowledge. It seems to me that by logic and reason, Science and Technology should be self-governing, within the limits of law. Sagan does not even consider the possibility. He assumes, society (and therefore Government) will run (monitor, reward and admonish) Science and Technology. He advises us this will likely blow up in our faces, and guess what… His solution, was to throw gasoline on the combustible mixture. Enter, his hand picked protégé Neil deGrasse Tyson. Tyson has claimed that based on Science, he is confident there is no God. Based on Science alone, no Scientist can conclude there is no God. I love this one: “The Universe is under no obligation to make sense to you.” ― Neil deGrasse Tyson And yet, the idea of God does not make sense to him, therefore no belief in such is warranted. God is obligated to the mind of man, but the universe is not. “The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it.” ~ Tyson Except of course, when it is not true, as prescribed in the Scientific Method. He puts Science above the SM, when in fact Science ceases to exist with no SM. Fact: Science gets some very important things wrong.
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#3 Gender: Under the watchful eye of Sagan the Scientific Method began to crumble. Once thought experiments were “real” experiments. A group of wise and learned individuals would get together, talk about things, do some calculations, and arrive at some conclusion about the natural world. These proved to be very unreliable. By 1960, when I first studied the SM, experiments had to be hands on. This was very unhandy for scientists, who were anxious to get universal approval for pet theories of evolution and cosmology, where real experiments were impossible. Computers could solve that problem, by using them for thought experiments. So by 1970, thought experiments became part of the SM. "If you have a belief system that says an emergent scientific truth is not true, you should just give up." Neil degrasse Tyson Yes, if scientists think maybe something is true, you better get on board, or be an idiot. Where is Sagan’s skepticism? "But an emergent scientific truth, a truth that is true whether or not you believe in it. It requires more than one scientific paper. It requires a whole system of people's research, all leaning in the same direction, all pointing to the same consequences. That's what we have, with climate change as induced by human conduct. " Tyson Climate change us real? The Science is settled. No skepticism needed. Thought experiments rule. Thought experiments are the tip of the iceberg. Peer review is an inconvenience. In actual experiments, theoretical numbers replace actual experimental data, because they disagree. Corruption at every corner, money and the marketplace rule Science, not knowledge. The meaning of “species” is no longer dependent on genetics. Two individuals may be genetically identical, but belong to two different species. With finches, song and diet are critical, so determine species, not genetics. It is a small step from saying genetics is irrelevant in species determination, to genetics is irrelevant in gender determination.
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Artaipray "P.S. I guess that society and Government are not the same, is it?" In this case, I will use what others have written. I see no disagreement in what these difference sources describe. I agree with them. "The society is the entity that include all the individuals of a city, state, or country. Government is one of the institutions of the society that has monopoly on the use of force within that society to provide law and order. " Or "Some writers have so confounded (confused) society with government, as to leave little or no distinction between them; whereas they are not only different, but have different origins. Society is produced by our wants, and government by our wickedness; the former promotes our happiness POSITIVELY by uniting our affections, the latter NEGATIVELY by restraining our vices." Or "The government should only be in the business of laying down the floor for Liberties – and Society should be doing most everything else. But Progressives believe that Society, the aggregation of Individual Citizens of America, is incapable of doing anything. Instead, the Government should be in charge – of everything." As you read this last quote, think about Carl Sagan. He offered no reason, or justification for Government being in control of Science. He seems to accept it as a given - Government controls Science, because it should. If Science is a source of knowledge, then Government "should" control it, that is what Sagan implies. He is a Progressive. The opposite of Progressive is Conservative. Progressives are invariably American Marxists. In their hearts, Sagan and Tyson are the same. Progressives think Government should control Society. Conservatives think Society should control Government. Who is in charge - the people (society), or the Government. Sagan wants Government in charge. I welcome disagreement. We learn very little from those who agree with us. With disagreement and discussion, both sides increase their knowledge.
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Thanks for the information. There are plenty of details to think about, which nowadays is a rare thing offered to the masses. Your sentence that Sagan wants the government in charge does not make me feel good. When famous people express their opinions about topics that they do not know deeply, listeners or viewers can accept their thoughts as it would be authoritative truth without doubt and questioning.
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